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<blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 8341573" data-attributes="member: 42582">I've never read or played it but have seen it discussed online, and I had the same vague recollection.There's little doubt about that!Yep.I'm using citing the one Moldvay book. If you're thinking of plural Basic D&amp;D Books that might be post-Moldvay Mentzer - I've seen it back in the day but never played it. To the extent that it and Moldvay differ, I incline towards Moldvay, but that's a different story!Anyway, I think you're right in what you say here. I think writing 5e as a &quot;compromise&quot; (those scare quotes are doing a lot of work there) and &quot;recovery&quot; edition had something to do with it - there was a lot of hostility from existing D&amp;D players towards the instructional-type text in 4e. And avoiding that hostility was seen - rightly, I would say - as a necessary condition of getting any broader traction including among new players.I don't think that's the only explanation. AD&amp;D 2nd ed wasn't produced under quite the same sorts of pressures, but it also is weak in instructional text compared to Gygax's version, I think - and Gygax's AD&amp;D is itself weak compared to Moldvay. So I think Moldvay benefited both from there being no wider context of aversion to advice plus someone who knew how to write game instructions well.Anyway, you probably know as well as anyone else who posts on these boards that I've got fairly strong preferences in RPGing and being railroaded through Phandelver isn't central to them - but I'd still prefer the books come out and at least set out a &quot;typical&quot; approach to play which is not just the GM describes the environment - what do you do? but that the GM will tell you where you are, what you're there for and what makes sense as your next step so that beginners have somewhere to start. Given that I still think there's a bit of &quot;hunting for the plot&quot; in non-beginner play as well (I certainly saw plenty of it back when I was a club player, and I don't get the feeling the world has changed that much) that sort of advice might be helpful for non-beginners also.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="pemerton, post: 8341573, member: 42582"] I've never read or played it but have seen it discussed online, and I had the same vague recollection. There's little doubt about that! Yep. I'm using citing the one Moldvay book. If you're thinking of plural Basic D&D Books that might be post-Moldvay Mentzer - I've seen it back in the day but never played it. To the extent that it and Moldvay differ, I incline towards Moldvay, but that's a different story! Anyway, I think you're right in what you say here. I think writing 5e as a "compromise" (those scare quotes are doing a lot of work there) and "recovery" edition had something to do with it - there was a lot of hostility from existing D&D players towards the instructional-type text in 4e. And avoiding that hostility was seen - rightly, I would say - as a necessary condition of getting any broader traction including among new players. I don't think that's the only explanation. AD&D 2nd ed wasn't produced under quite the same sorts of pressures, but it also is weak in instructional text compared to Gygax's version, I think - and Gygax's AD&D is itself weak compared to Moldvay. So I think Moldvay benefited both from there being no wider context of aversion to advice [I]plus[/I] someone who knew how to write game instructions well. Anyway, you probably know as well as anyone else who posts on these boards that I've got fairly strong preferences in RPGing and being railroaded through Phandelver isn't central to them - but I'd still prefer the books come out and at least set out a "typical" approach to play which is not just [I]the GM describes the environment - what do you do? [/I]but that [I]the GM will tell you where you are, what you're there for and what makes sense as your next step[/I] so that beginners have somewhere to start. Given that I still think there's a bit of "hunting for the plot" in non-beginner play as well (I certainly saw plenty of it back when I was a club player, and I don't get the feeling the world has changed [I]that [/I]much) that sort of advice might be helpful for non-beginners also. [/QUOTE]

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