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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Skallgrim" data-source="post: 4732085" data-attributes="member: 79271"><img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/rant.png"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":rant:" title="Rant    :rant:" data-shortname=":rant:" />OK, well, first, most of these healing resources use the characters's own Healing Surges, so while they have more access to them during a fight, they aren't any more capable of healing over the course of a day than any other party of adventurers.  Thus, in theory, they shouldn't need any more challenging encounters than any other adventuring group.Second, I know that you feel like "a villain" for forcing them to soldier on without access to their full brigade of healing surges, but GET OVER IT!The entire group made a choice to pick powers that used a lot of healing surges.  Then, in EACH encounter, they choose to use a LOT of those powers  to heal (and thus expend healing surges).  Then, they complain about being out of surges.  Your party is a gang of babies.You don't have to use a ton of healing surges in every encounter.  You can play tactically, or carefully, or surgically.  My group usually finishes each fight, even the level +3 ones, having used about two Healing Words, one Bastion of Health, and 1-5 second winds.  We rely on the clerical healing first, since it is a minor action, and more effective, and sometimes, someone goes down.Your party is CHOOSING to play balls-to-the-wall crazy and use up all of these healing surges in one fight, and then resent going on?  Are these people heroes or professional athletes?A group might CHOOSE to unleash all of their daily power in the first two rounds of a fight, to make it end quickly, but that doesn't mean the system is broken, or the DM is mean, if they have trouble with the next four fights when they have to fight them with encounter powers only. The group has made a deliberate, really, really bad choice with their resource management, and is expecting a DM to rejigger the entire world to reflect it.  Screw them.First, explain the actual situation to the players (in case they are total dweebs):"You are a party of heroic adventurers.You will often be asked, or volunteer, or be paid, or be forced, into dangerous quests and adventures.These adventures WILL NOT often consist of a single fight, after which you have a lovely dinner and a good night's rest.Often, they will consist of a series of linked battles, or you may happen upon additional enemies.  Sometimes, the enemies may attack you when you are not expecting it, or not ready for it.  Sometimes, you may EVEN need to "take the battle to" an enemy who is going to do something horrible (sacrifice captives, summon demons, blow up a church) if you don't stop them VERY SOON.In any case, you should not expect to be able to relax and move on only when you "volunteer" to do so.During these adventures, you will marshall your resources.  This will include ammunition, daily magic item powers, consumable items, daily powers, and healing surges.If you CHOOSE to expend all of your resources, in any one category, or in multiple categories, in a single encounter, then, quite logically, you can expect them to be unavailable in another encounter.  Drinking all of the potions in the first fight will not result in the goblins in the next room waiting for you to go home and buy more before they attack you.This means, for those of you that haven't figured it out yet, that PLANNING on using all of your healing surges in the first fight MEANS that you will be unable to heal yourself in any subsequent fights."Alternatively, if they simply can't wrap their tiny little minds around resource management in ANY WAY, run every encounter group as ONE BIG ENCOUNTER.  Instead of having an equal level fight in the first room, then an equal level fight in the second area, then a sub level fight in the third area, then an above level fight in the fourth area, just use all of the monsters for a 4xlevel fight, and introduce them in waves.  This will probably kill the adventurers, as they will never get their encounter powers back, but maybe their next group of characters will figure out how to CONSERVE AMMUNITION.Seriously, there are real design tradeoffs to be made with the Extended Rest/Five Encounter design paradigm.  I'm not disputing that, and I'm not claiming to have solved it.  However, this isn't one of them.This is a group of spoiled baby gamers who want to use daily resources as encounter resources.  It's no different than wanting your daily spells and exploits to be available in each encounter.  If you want to mollycoddle them,  go ahead.  But don't think those of us who expect our players to not be entirely brain-dead, and who expect HEROES to be heroic, are being mean to our group.<img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/rant.png"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":rant:" title="Rant    :rant:" data-shortname=":rant:" /></blockquote>

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