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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Lauberfen" data-source="post: 4736541" data-attributes="member: 71418">Thinking about it some more, I'm wondering about the maths behind the problem.You have 5 players. They have can spend about 10 surges before they need to second wind or use potions.Now, your characters should have 6-15 surges each. Damage is not spread equally in a party, granted, so let's be extreme and assume only 2 characters need to spend surges. It's also fair in that case to assume these are defenders, so should have 9-15 surges each. The way I see it, They can still only use 12 surges or so between the two of them, leaving them about half their surges each.If this is the kind of level where their stopping for an extended rest, then there is something seriously wrong with them, and you need to take steps as described above to make it less easy to rest.The fact is, at half surges, a party should be good for another 2-3 encounters, unless they are seriously challenging.Perhaps the problem is that if you throw a second encounter at them as hard as the first, then it's too tough? However, the gap between their surges to spend per encounter, and + their dailies shouldn't be that big- at most about 5-6 surges. What I'm saying is they should still be able to take another encounter, just this time they'll need to spread damage across the whole  party, use second wind and maybe potions. This might teach them not to go nova in the first encounter of the day.So in summary- 1: are they literally running out of surges after 1 encounter? If so how?2: If not, they can surely take several encounters per day, even if the first is relatively easy because they go crazy on powers. 3: If they still have surges and are resting, then you'll have to add incentives not to rest.One further point- I absolutely disagree about surges being all or nothing- Clearly there is little difference until you have 5 or less surges. However 3 surges is already noticebaly different than 4, and 2 is different again- it's like in third when you're cleric's down to one healing spell- I'd want to make sure I didn't have any big fights before I could rest. The only difference between 1 and 0 is that it's harder to be healed with 0- you're still limited to around your hit point total.</blockquote>

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