Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="airwalkrr" data-source="post: 3333536" data-attributes="member: 12460">I did not ask "why," I asked "how?" Explain to me what process goes on for it to occur.Here is how I see it. If I take 20 on a Search check, the mechanical result is the same as if I kept rolling until I got a 20. I may make the DC with a roll of 15, but I keep rolling until I get the 20, just to be sure. But this is not based on the fact that my CHARACTER knows he rolled a 20. It is based on the simplicity of assuming that I just keep rolling until I get a 20, which statistically, is VERY likely to occur if I roll 20 times. In this case, I am trying to accomplished a specific task with a specific DC. But Hide is much different. It does not represent accomplishing a specific task so much as it represents your relative ability to accomplish a task. It is a variable and relative task because it has a variable and relative DC. If I retry "just to make sure," how can I make sure my roll is actually a 20? I may have a friend helping me, but there is no feedback to tell me that my Hide check was good enough to stop retrying. Once I make a Hide check, I could keep the process of hiding going for a theoretically indefinite amount of time. If I make a Search check and I take twenty times as long so that I am reasonably sure I have done my best, everything I need to know I have done my best is right there in that 5 foot square I am searching. But if I am making a Hide check, everything I need to take 20 is not there unless there is someone "aiding" me with a Spot bonus one point lower than my Hide check.I think you misspoke somewhere in there because that does not make sense to me. How does the Hide check I failed cause me to become hidden?Assuming that you meant to say "the Hide check you failed caused you to become seen," then I believe you are simply mistaken. If I have a Hide check of +40 and make a Hide check of 50, then an invisible, incorporeal character who is making no noise (essentially undetectable) enters the room and spots me, but does absolutely nothing about it, how does that cause me to become "unhidden?" Relative to that character, yes, but not to a goblin with a +1 Spot check who walks into the room later.I believe that is what I said (although I choose a different way of phrasing it). So what is your point? Just because I am not hidden from one character does not mean I cannot be hidden from another. If I make a Hide check, then two goblins enter a room, #1 sees me and #2 does not, then we roll initiative, I beat goblin 2 and make an attack against him. Goblin 2 is still flat-footed regardless of what goblin 1 saw unless goblin 1 was able to take some action that revealed me to goblin 2 (like casting glitterdust). Goblin 1 does not confer the "unhidden" quality upon me just because he saw me. It only means I was unhidden relative to him and not goblin 2.</blockquote>

Verification