Cannibalism and Human Sacrifice

[Raven Crowking]

Reading through some of these "Is This Evil?" threads -- most recently about slavery -- has made me wonder how far EnWorlders are willing to push moral relativism. For example, is there anyone here who would be willing to argue that cannibalism and human sacrifice are not evil?


RC

 

[hong]

Squeezable cheese is evil. No question.

 

[Dakkareth]

Not more so than murder, because that's what it is.

 

[JackGiantkiller]

I'll take the bait.

Cannibalism: Ritual cannibalism of those who die of natural causes, especially one's own ancestors, was (and perhaps is) a venerated custom of some tribal societies of Africa and the Pacific Islands. I cannot call such a custom, where no sentient is actually harmed, an evil.

There are arguments to be made (though I won't make them) that killing to survive is not evil, and thus the hunting/killing mode of cannibalism would not be evil under those circumstances where there is not a sufficent supply of other edibles to support the local population or where they do not have access to another source of specific nutrients that can be found in human flesh, would also not be evil, under those specific circumstances.

Human sacrifice: If the sacrifice is willing, and gives themself in the sincere belief that they are dying to save their people, then the practice cannot be considered evil. This is, at least according to some historical sources, the model under which much (but not all) human sacrifice was practiced by the druids, and possibly by the Aztec as well. In addition, the Aztecs truly believed the sun would cease to rise if not fed, and the Celts believed tha under certain circumstances all their people would die because of prolonged winter, blight, or drought. Thus their sacrifices were intended to ensure their survival. Again, killing to to survive. On the other hand there was certainly much unwilling sacrifice in human history, and the depraved practice of human sacrifice to dark entities in a plea for personal power is certainly evil, if and when it occurs.

 

[fusangite]

Sure! I'll also oblige with an "it depends," with the qualifier that I am referring to my own implementation of the alignment rules and not the literal letter of them in the PHB. Although I have never run a campaign with cannibalism or human sacrifce, I would argue that pre-Columbian Mexican cannibalism and human sacrifice were non-evil.

One of the ways sacrifice victims were selected was through a ball game. Two teams would compete for the opportunity to be sacrificed, which was seen as a privilege. Being sacrificed to the gods and possibly eaten by the priests was something to which many victims not only consented but fought for the chance to do. While the Flowery War, the more common way to obtain sacrifice victims, was less consensual, men could still technically choose not to join the ceremonial war and thereby make themselves ineligible for sacrifice but this is a slightly more complicated case as there were real social repercussions for non-participation.

 

[Lonely Tylenol]

Yeah, I don't see anything inherently wrong about eating people, aside from the considerations of murder. It depends on the circumstances leading up to the act. Groups of people in places with protein-poor diets sometimes had to resort to cannibalism because otherwise they would suffer or possibly die from protein deficiency. When it's a matter of "do we jump this stranger who happens to be travelling nearby or do we let our children die?" things get a little complex. When someone's already dead, the decision gets easier. Many regions of the world (places like South America or Indonesia) simply do not have many native plants that have high protein content, nor domesticable animals, so protein is limited by what is available to hunters...which can be hit or miss. This is true, at least, until Europeans show up with their pigs and chickens and wheat, which are always welcome additions to a farmer's repertoire.

However, eating the dead is non a good idea for practical reasons. After all, they might have died from something that can kill you too. For example, there was a tribe of people somewhere in southeast asia who used to eat the brains of their dead ancestors. This eventually led to the development of a disease--unique to the region--that resembled mad cow disease. Their brains housed prions similar to those that cause mad cow, and by eating the brains of the dead (who usually died from this disease), they passed it on. Some anthropologists noticed and told them that it would be a good idea to stop eating the dead, but it took a hell of a lot of convincing to get them to break with tradition.

 

[DMH]

Lost Prehistorica has a section on cannibalism and a class where neurological damage occurs as the prions destroy the brain. I would never take that class, but it does make for an interesting opponent who has knowledge from those he has eaten.

I wonder if illithids ever die from prion related illnesses?

 

[Nifft]

I wonder if illithids ever die from prion related illnesses?

Psion-related more likely.

-- N

 

[Turjan]

I'm also in the "It depends" camp.

Cannibalism: Cannibalism was usually not practiced by hunting other humans for meat. The tribes that lent their name to the practice ate the warriors of enemy tribes after the fight. Actually, this was considered an honour. The strength of the enemy was supposed to pass over to into the eater (a concept very similar to the holy communion nowadays). A cowardly enemy was not considered worth to be eaten.

Human sacrifice: I don't want to reiterate the Aztec and Celtic examples, because they illustrate the moral situation very well. The practicers - and sometimes the victims - believed in the necessity of the practice for the world to go on. This is brutal, but not evil. The situation is very much unlike that one usually depicted in D&D, because in D&D the evil priests and worshippers make human sacrifices by choice - there are enough other deities to be worshipped who don't demand human sacrifices; this case is definitely evil.

 

[the Jester]

No harm, no foul. It depends- if everyone involved is willing, truly willing, I don't see how something can be considered evil. Cannibalism- well, there's nobody unwilling, that's for sure!

I actually have a base class imc called the Cannabix, who gains ability increases at 2nd and every 4 levels thereafter by eating the hearts of worthy foes. They're kind of a chaotic twist on druids, with the ability increases instead of the druidic special abilities and slightly more limited spells. They don't have to be evil.