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Cantrip Auto-Scaling - A 5e Critique
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<blockquote data-quote="FrogReaver" data-source="post: 7534092" data-attributes="member: 6795602"><p>You are bringing up 2 points. The first is that ammunition is a resource that doesn't actually enhance your capabilities. I disagree there. Even a str based 2 handed weapon fighter has a situational use for ammunition (flying enemies). In contrast I don't believe there are useful times to cast low level damage spells. Though I at least believe that question is worth exploring and I could be persuaded of it with a thoughtful and reasoned analysis.</p><p></p><p>The second point you are saying I agree with in some way. Actions are a resource in the sense of action economy. The point of note about action resources is that every ability we are discussing has the same action resource cost. They all require your action. So talking about the action economy resource component of the abilities we are discussing doesn't change anything except that bringing it up now means I have to write a paragraph to actually make the same point I was making in shorthand before. Which is going to lead to accustations that I'm moving the goal posts when all I'm actually doing is making a more explicit formal declaration of the same intuitive point I started the discussion with.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I agree other spells cast with a level 1 spell slot are meaningful and often worth doing over a cantrip. However, I actually can ignore that a spell can be cast with a higher level slot because a higher level slot isn't the same resource as the lower level slot. So that has nothing to do with my argument. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I've never pretended a 1st level slot should be as valuable at level 11 or 17. What I am saying is that regardless of what spell is cast from it that the effect should be something stronger than a cantrip. A 1st level spell cast in a 1st level slot can both be stronger than a cantrip and be less valuable as you level. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I agree that a 1st level slot is a marginal resource at higher levels. I agree that it's a very versatile resource. That said, damage is one of the options you have of using that resource on. If damage is an option for you to spend a resource on then it should be at least marginally better than if you didn't spend a resource on damage at all.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Whether 1st level spells cast in first level slots do more damage than a cantrip or less than one, all of the above points will still remain true. When your points can just as easily be said about my suggested change as the current game then they aren't meaningful points to be making.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Correction: Some 1st level spells are better than cantrips. Others are worse. What's the problem with fixing the ones that are worse?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="FrogReaver, post: 7534092, member: 6795602"] You are bringing up 2 points. The first is that ammunition is a resource that doesn't actually enhance your capabilities. I disagree there. Even a str based 2 handed weapon fighter has a situational use for ammunition (flying enemies). In contrast I don't believe there are useful times to cast low level damage spells. Though I at least believe that question is worth exploring and I could be persuaded of it with a thoughtful and reasoned analysis. The second point you are saying I agree with in some way. Actions are a resource in the sense of action economy. The point of note about action resources is that every ability we are discussing has the same action resource cost. They all require your action. So talking about the action economy resource component of the abilities we are discussing doesn't change anything except that bringing it up now means I have to write a paragraph to actually make the same point I was making in shorthand before. Which is going to lead to accustations that I'm moving the goal posts when all I'm actually doing is making a more explicit formal declaration of the same intuitive point I started the discussion with. I agree other spells cast with a level 1 spell slot are meaningful and often worth doing over a cantrip. However, I actually can ignore that a spell can be cast with a higher level slot because a higher level slot isn't the same resource as the lower level slot. So that has nothing to do with my argument. I've never pretended a 1st level slot should be as valuable at level 11 or 17. What I am saying is that regardless of what spell is cast from it that the effect should be something stronger than a cantrip. A 1st level spell cast in a 1st level slot can both be stronger than a cantrip and be less valuable as you level. I agree that a 1st level slot is a marginal resource at higher levels. I agree that it's a very versatile resource. That said, damage is one of the options you have of using that resource on. If damage is an option for you to spend a resource on then it should be at least marginally better than if you didn't spend a resource on damage at all. Whether 1st level spells cast in first level slots do more damage than a cantrip or less than one, all of the above points will still remain true. When your points can just as easily be said about my suggested change as the current game then they aren't meaningful points to be making. Correction: Some 1st level spells are better than cantrips. Others are worse. What's the problem with fixing the ones that are worse? [/QUOTE]
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Cantrip Auto-Scaling - A 5e Critique
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