Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Cantrip nerf (house rule brainstorm)
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="NotAYakk" data-source="post: 8239063" data-attributes="member: 72555"><p>The thing is, using an action on a combat Cantrip isn't a great contribution.</p><p></p><p>At level 1, fire bolt deals 1d10 damage. Its big advantage is that it (a) uses intelligence, and (b) looks magicky.</p><p></p><p>A 14 dex wizard with a light crossbow has -1 to hit and +1 to damage if they just use a light crossbow over firebolt. That is small enough that you won't really notice the difference in the results of a combat.</p><p></p><p>But a lower dex wizard ends up being increasingly incompetent; in effect, the lack of FB cantrip means that combat utility of low level wizards is tied to dex (or strength in theory) unless you go with the 5 minute adventuring day of "1 fight per day".</p><p></p><p>At 1 fight per day, even a level 1 wizard has enough leveled slots to contribute with no cantrips, regardless of dex.</p><p></p><p>By level 5, FB far outpaces the crossbow; the 18 int wizard has +2 to hit and does 11 damage, vs the 6.5 of the 14 dex light crossbow wizard. If there is an extended adventuring day (more than 1 or 2 encounters), that wizard could run short of leveled spell slots.</p><p></p><p>OTOH, even that 11 damage starts meaning less. A level 5 XBE gloomstalker ranger might be putting out 33 damage almost every round on hits (HM, Bonus action, Gloomstalker bonus attack on first round, etc), and the wizard not contributing 11 at similar accuracy isn't going to be a huge factor in the outcome of the fight.</p><p></p><p>As others have noted, the effect is much larger with Warlocks. They rely on the Eldritch Blast cantrip far more than full spellcasters do, especially when (as many DMs seem to) push 1 big encounter adventuring days. With many small encounters with short rests between them, they have slots for most rounds; with a single big many-round encounter, they run out of spell slot gas very fast.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="NotAYakk, post: 8239063, member: 72555"] The thing is, using an action on a combat Cantrip isn't a great contribution. At level 1, fire bolt deals 1d10 damage. Its big advantage is that it (a) uses intelligence, and (b) looks magicky. A 14 dex wizard with a light crossbow has -1 to hit and +1 to damage if they just use a light crossbow over firebolt. That is small enough that you won't really notice the difference in the results of a combat. But a lower dex wizard ends up being increasingly incompetent; in effect, the lack of FB cantrip means that combat utility of low level wizards is tied to dex (or strength in theory) unless you go with the 5 minute adventuring day of "1 fight per day". At 1 fight per day, even a level 1 wizard has enough leveled slots to contribute with no cantrips, regardless of dex. By level 5, FB far outpaces the crossbow; the 18 int wizard has +2 to hit and does 11 damage, vs the 6.5 of the 14 dex light crossbow wizard. If there is an extended adventuring day (more than 1 or 2 encounters), that wizard could run short of leveled spell slots. OTOH, even that 11 damage starts meaning less. A level 5 XBE gloomstalker ranger might be putting out 33 damage almost every round on hits (HM, Bonus action, Gloomstalker bonus attack on first round, etc), and the wizard not contributing 11 at similar accuracy isn't going to be a huge factor in the outcome of the fight. As others have noted, the effect is much larger with Warlocks. They rely on the Eldritch Blast cantrip far more than full spellcasters do, especially when (as many DMs seem to) push 1 big encounter adventuring days. With many small encounters with short rests between them, they have slots for most rounds; with a single big many-round encounter, they run out of spell slot gas very fast. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Cantrip nerf (house rule brainstorm)
Top