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*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Cantrips as encounter powers?
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<blockquote data-quote="nogray" data-source="post: 5944403" data-attributes="member: 28028"><p>Ahh. Thanks for the clarification. Though, to be honest, I'm not sure what you mean by some of the later parts of your post. I can agree with the forced quasi-demonic flavor being problematic, and that is why I tended to refluff it to be fey-themed, at least on my Chaotic Good warlocks, and sometimes on my CN ones. (The cold-iron DR fits well, here, as do several of the powers.)</p><p></p><p>What has me confused is the application of "game-wrecking" to eldritch blast, the self-healing being called "automatic," and the phrase "instant magic items."</p><p></p><p>The warlock's eldritch blast does less damage than the bonus sneak attack damage of a rogue. While the rogue can't SA undead or constructs -- at least without various feats and whatnot -- and so loses in those areas for damage, the warlock's EB has to deal with SR -- or energy resistance to acid, which is a later invocation choice and is only available later in the warlock's career -- plus possible disruption.) It has less range than any bow or crossbow (except maybe the hand crossbow), and it can't be used in a full attack. While the warlock doesn't have to worry about ammo, the bow-user will often be more damaging. (This is a bit of a reversal from the standard "martial is at will, but magic is more effective due to its limited uses" meme.) I'd love more information as to why it is game-breaking to you.</p><p></p><p>The self-healing's biggest benefit is that it is a free action to activate. That much is pretty potent, but other than that, it seems to me to be a really weak class feature. It amounts to 20 points of healing (40 at 13th level, 100 at 18th) per day. That is likely to be less than or on par with a paladin, and certainly less than even one of a cleric's spells. It is (until the last level of it is acquired) pretty on-par with a monk's self-healing. The monk has less points, but can dole it out as-needed. The warlock's is also limited in that it is fast healing, so it comes pretty slowly -- much to slow to save himself in combat. Regarding the use of "automatic," it does require a (free) action to activate, so it's not like you can use it to auto-stabilize yourself. (Depending on your reading of free actions, you might be able to activate it on a monsters turn before they attack you (or even between two attacks), but once you are struck, assuming that the hit is enough to put you unconscious, it is too late to act.)</p><p></p><p>The one that really gets my curiosity up, though, is the "instant magic items." They can qualify for making magic items pretty easily, but they have no advantages in the creation thereof, and each item type they want to make consumes a valuable feat. (No bonus feats like a wizard or, since you mentioned Eberron, an artificer.) They are only really good at qualifying for arcane-spell-based items, too. Divine spells are considerably harder for them to emulate. (Though the fact that they can potentially emulate divine spells does give them an advantage over an item-making wizard, it really doesn't help if the wizard had a cleric to help him -- either in the party or paid to assist.)</p><p></p><p>As a further aside, some of the books that you mentioned (<em>Book of Nine Swords</em>, <em>Tome of Magic</em> (the Binder chapter, anyway), and <em>Magic of Incarnum</em> (okay, so you didn't mention that one)) are some of my favorite parts of 3.5. Similarly, <em>Complete Mage</em>'s reserve feats (that may have appeared elsewhere, too) and <em>Player's Handbook II</em>'s combat focus feats and "beyond specialization" feats are also pretty neat to me. Some sort of help non-casters do more interesting things, and others help casters limit their reliance on big, fire-and-forget spells.</p><p></p><p>Whether you reply to this or not, thank you for what understanding you have imparted so far. Though I have some difficulty aligning my experiences to your stated views, I am grateful for the opportunity to discuss them.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="nogray, post: 5944403, member: 28028"] Ahh. Thanks for the clarification. Though, to be honest, I'm not sure what you mean by some of the later parts of your post. I can agree with the forced quasi-demonic flavor being problematic, and that is why I tended to refluff it to be fey-themed, at least on my Chaotic Good warlocks, and sometimes on my CN ones. (The cold-iron DR fits well, here, as do several of the powers.) What has me confused is the application of "game-wrecking" to eldritch blast, the self-healing being called "automatic," and the phrase "instant magic items." The warlock's eldritch blast does less damage than the bonus sneak attack damage of a rogue. While the rogue can't SA undead or constructs -- at least without various feats and whatnot -- and so loses in those areas for damage, the warlock's EB has to deal with SR -- or energy resistance to acid, which is a later invocation choice and is only available later in the warlock's career -- plus possible disruption.) It has less range than any bow or crossbow (except maybe the hand crossbow), and it can't be used in a full attack. While the warlock doesn't have to worry about ammo, the bow-user will often be more damaging. (This is a bit of a reversal from the standard "martial is at will, but magic is more effective due to its limited uses" meme.) I'd love more information as to why it is game-breaking to you. The self-healing's biggest benefit is that it is a free action to activate. That much is pretty potent, but other than that, it seems to me to be a really weak class feature. It amounts to 20 points of healing (40 at 13th level, 100 at 18th) per day. That is likely to be less than or on par with a paladin, and certainly less than even one of a cleric's spells. It is (until the last level of it is acquired) pretty on-par with a monk's self-healing. The monk has less points, but can dole it out as-needed. The warlock's is also limited in that it is fast healing, so it comes pretty slowly -- much to slow to save himself in combat. Regarding the use of "automatic," it does require a (free) action to activate, so it's not like you can use it to auto-stabilize yourself. (Depending on your reading of free actions, you might be able to activate it on a monsters turn before they attack you (or even between two attacks), but once you are struck, assuming that the hit is enough to put you unconscious, it is too late to act.) The one that really gets my curiosity up, though, is the "instant magic items." They can qualify for making magic items pretty easily, but they have no advantages in the creation thereof, and each item type they want to make consumes a valuable feat. (No bonus feats like a wizard or, since you mentioned Eberron, an artificer.) They are only really good at qualifying for arcane-spell-based items, too. Divine spells are considerably harder for them to emulate. (Though the fact that they can potentially emulate divine spells does give them an advantage over an item-making wizard, it really doesn't help if the wizard had a cleric to help him -- either in the party or paid to assist.) As a further aside, some of the books that you mentioned ([i]Book of Nine Swords[/i], [i]Tome of Magic[/i] (the Binder chapter, anyway), and [i]Magic of Incarnum[/i] (okay, so you didn't mention that one)) are some of my favorite parts of 3.5. Similarly, [i]Complete Mage[/i]'s reserve feats (that may have appeared elsewhere, too) and [i]Player's Handbook II[/i]'s combat focus feats and "beyond specialization" feats are also pretty neat to me. Some sort of help non-casters do more interesting things, and others help casters limit their reliance on big, fire-and-forget spells. Whether you reply to this or not, thank you for what understanding you have imparted so far. Though I have some difficulty aligning my experiences to your stated views, I am grateful for the opportunity to discuss them. [/QUOTE]
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