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Message: <blockquote data-quote="DND_Reborn" data-source="post: 8492632" data-attributes="member: 6987520">I agree those examples are heroic (what I want), not superheroic (what you want).Maximum human STR is 20, Primal Champion allows you to be better than human, i.e. "super-human" which makes it "super heroic" IMO anyway. But as I said, what is super heroic to you is probably crazy super heroic to me. For instance, there are lots of super heroes whose shtick is strength, but many of them are stronger than others--- still, their all super heroes.I was more focused on the not needing food or water---which is definitely beyond human.Sure, but as I wrote I was focused on the non-magical. Now, if you want to think in terms of Chiun running on water, you just have to run "very fast". <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> Still, well beyond mundane, so super heroic.[MEDIA=youtube]JmSmZRCl6A4[/MEDIA]You are immune to all disease! How is that not a super hero power!?! <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f633.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":oops:" title="Oops!    :oops:"  data-smilie="10"data-shortname=":oops:" />Right, which is why it is hard to argue them as "martials", since the are half/half.Which is why I also added Stroke of Luck. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />For some wizards, sure, but the examples were characters such as Gandalf and Merlin as well, which were non-human in origin.Certain non-human races, such as Goliaths, with features like powerful build, can easily place them well beyond human capabilities. Again, i.e. super human and thus the things they can do is super heroic.See above as to some of those examples.And wizards aren't "allowed to be demigods", their spells give them incredible, but very limited in use, power. Martials excel elsewhere. Do I think it is on an even keel? Certainly not and I've said so repeated. Even so, spells are not the be-all end-all in the game. I've seen plenty of wizards and other casters falter when martials strive. As always, (obviously) YMMV.And as far as I understand it, elements of Mythic Odyssey of Theros gave you the chance to be a demigod basically? I don't know as I don't own it. <img class="smilie smilie--emoji" alt="🤷‍♂️" src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f937-2642.png" title="Man shrugging    :man_shrugging:" data-shortname=":man_shrugging:" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" />Finally, as we've covered (repeatedly), what makes a PC super heroic is a matter of opinion. I think the class features I've outlined above do many PCs super heroes. They have abilities mundane people will never have and/or can do things they can not do. Many (at mid levels) are more heroic in nature, other features (especially at higher levels) are super heroic IMO.Again, might not be the super hero-like power you want, but its there either way as I see it.</blockquote>

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