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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Neonchameleon" data-source="post: 5912936" data-attributes="member: 87792">I am assuming you are actualy playing by the rules as written.  The rules that say that the wizard gets two free spells he can cast at each level - of the choice of the wizard.  I am further assuming that the wizard can choose which spells to prepare.  If assuming that you are not further house-ruling the game to nerf the wizards is where things go wrong, then possibly they are.Are you playing 3.5 by the rules?  Does the wizard have any reason to expect combat that day?  If the answer to both is yes, then I am assuming absolutely nothing except that the wizard is not stupid.  (And in the teleport example I specifically stated that the wizard was spending the night - the wizard, not the DM, gets to choose which spells the wizard memorises).No.  I'm assuming that the dice aren't extreme.  This is what the paper-scissors-stone I'm talking about is about.  Looking at a set of <a href="http://www.necromancergames.com/pdf/Characters2r.pdf" target="_blank">level 1 pregens</a>, the halfling rogue starts off with Reflex +8 and Fort and Will +2.  The dwarf fighter, meanwhile, starts off at fort +5, ref + 2, will +0.  The swings for picking the right save to attack are massive and only get greater at higher levels as the rogue focusses on dex and gains +1 to ref every two levels while he gains +1 to his other saves every three.Either he's taking the risk - assuming that the fighter's fort or the cleric's will will stand it to get an extra couple of bad guys (not a bad guess - the cleric's will is one of the few things that scales faster than the caster's DCs) or he's not taking quite the entire team of specialist mageslayers down.  Merely turning several of them into chumps.You don't need to catch them all.  You just need to be able to turn this into a defeat in detail.  A mopping up excercise for the rest of the party who get to fight the mageslayers more or less one at a time.Oh, I do hope there is!  I like having someone to laugh at.Seriously, <a href="http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/dispelMagic.htm" target="_blank">Greater Dispel Magic</a> is a bad choice to use in combat except against buffers.  The reason is that it only has a 50% chance of countering the spell it's used against (caster level check).  A wizard just as strong as I am spent just as much effort as I did in order to only half-counter me.  At a tactical level, this is an excellent trade.  And depending on the initiative order I very possibly ruined the turns of the people I cast at as well.So basically your counter to the wizard here is to add an equally powerful wizard on the other side - who then only uses inferior tactics to neutralise the wizard.  And this backing a team of specialist mage-slayers designed to counter spells?  And my wizard is still pulling his weight against them?  This isn't exactly helping the case that casters aren't overpowered, you realise?Maybe they did.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /><img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> happens.  Here's a hint: If it's going to screw anyone rather than just the wizard it's not outlining the wizard's weaknesses.  It does however outline a wizard's strengths - if the wizard survives the first round he can bail with Teleport or even Time Stop right back at the other caster.  No one else can (except possibly the cleric).Of course there is.  The difference is that a well played spellcaster brings a d8 (at least) to a d6 game, and gets a few reroll tokens.And now we're in an arms race.  Your ancient red dragon either needs to cover the volcano and be at home at the time or to be able to catch Frodo in the eighteen seconds between him popping invisibly to over Mount Doom, true striking and firing the arbalest, and teleporting away.And the thing is that the DM is the one that looks ridiculous here.  He's just created an ancient red dragon out of thin air to foil what is a reasonable use of resources on the character sheet.  An ancient red dragon who could probably munch the whole party.  (And no, Anticipate Teleport won't work.  I'm a long way away).  I'm playing rough with the bad guys - and the DM has just created an ancient dragon out of nowhere to deal with a 9th level party - and that will almost certainly fail.  The fighter isn't even in the same game.I have said this in a lot of threads if a DM feels that a spell is impossible to work with take it out of your game or modify it.Time Stop?  Summon Monster?</blockquote>

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