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<blockquote data-quote="EzekielRaiden" data-source="post: 8612177" data-attributes="member: 6790260">Though, as I said in my initial post, the critical element of achieving &quot;less is more&quot; is by actually doing more with less. I.e., each&nbsp; individual element must work harder because you are choosing to have fewer of them. If the individual elements aren't actually working any harder (or indeed are working less hard than they were before), then less is, in fact, less.Personally, I would fold Monk into Rogue (ninja are often characterized as a subtype of Monk), and Ranger into Barbarian. That way, no class is absorbing more than two other classes.I think I'd favor lumping Bard and Warlock together, rather than Rogue. So you might have, as Patrons, options like the Unending Chorus (music/song focus) and the First and Last Word (oratory, Vicious Mockery), while the Pact of the Harp could be a new feature to cover some of the other Bard components. Meanwhile, the Pact of the Bloodline would be all about unlocking the secret potential within you, and various bloodlines would become Patrons, e.g. Elemental Dragon or Grandmother Storm. Sadly, the Pact of the Bloodline would almost certainly need more features because the only thing Sorcerers get is metamagic.It of course pains me greatly to see Paladin demoted to a mere subclass, but that's likely what would have to happen. Personally, I think Cleric is already a bit overstuffed with subclasses, so I might actually favor having Cleric not absorb anything and instead fold Druid into Barbarian. Rage and the Totem options already resemble transformation effects, so it's not a huge leap.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="EzekielRaiden, post: 8612177, member: 6790260"] Though, as I said in my initial post, the critical element of achieving "less is more" is by actually [I]doing[/I] more [I]with[/I] less. I.e., each individual element must work harder because you are choosing to have fewer of them. If the individual elements aren't actually working any harder (or indeed are working [I]less[/I] hard than they were before), then less is, in fact, [I]less[/I]. Personally, I would fold Monk into Rogue (ninja are often characterized as a subtype of Monk), and Ranger into Barbarian. That way, no class is absorbing more than two other classes. I think I'd favor lumping Bard and Warlock together, rather than Rogue. So you might have, as Patrons, options like the Unending Chorus (music/song focus) and the First and Last Word (oratory, Vicious Mockery), while the Pact of the Harp could be a new feature to cover some of the other Bard components. Meanwhile, the Pact of the Bloodline would be all about unlocking the secret potential within you, and various bloodlines would become Patrons, e.g. Elemental Dragon or Grandmother Storm. Sadly, the Pact of the Bloodline would almost certainly need more features because [I]the only thing Sorcerers get is metamagic[/I]. It of course pains me greatly to see Paladin demoted to a mere subclass, but that's likely what would have to happen. Personally, I think Cleric is already a bit overstuffed with subclasses, so I might actually favor having Cleric not absorb [I]anything[/I] and instead fold Druid into Barbarian. Rage and the Totem options already resemble transformation effects, so it's not a huge leap. [/QUOTE]

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