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<blockquote data-quote="howandwhy99" data-source="post: 4515739" data-attributes="member: 3192">Of course, but no one's trying to claim eating Cheetos is role-playing.&nbsp; Or throwing dice at the DM.&nbsp; Integral to gaming? Maybe <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin&nbsp; &nbsp; :D"&nbsp; data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" />&nbsp; But no one's trying to redefine these under &quot;What is an RPG?&quot;.&nbsp; I've said I call these hybrid games.&nbsp; That's not a bad thing.&nbsp; Same as Poker is not necessarily a bluffing game.&nbsp; It's a game about statistical analysis and the telling of lies and guessing of tells.I think you're missing the pleasure of role-playing out how the player can succeed at this endeavor.&nbsp; Researching a spell doesn't need to be &quot;roll a die&quot;.&nbsp; Nor working with your Order need be &quot;tell me what your Order consists of&quot;, so you can &quot;just say&quot; a good explanation of your Paladin's success.&nbsp; This is the Skill Challenge irrationality all over again.&nbsp; Defining a part of the world so it makes sense with what has come before is a challenge, but it isn't a role-playing challenge.&nbsp; You can't define the world in order to win and still be winning at role-playing.&nbsp; This is what I meant by make-believe.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="howandwhy99, post: 4515739, member: 3192"] Of course, but no one's trying to claim eating Cheetos is role-playing. Or throwing dice at the DM. Integral to gaming? Maybe :D But no one's trying to redefine these under "What is an RPG?". I've said I call these hybrid games. That's not a bad thing. Same as Poker is not necessarily a bluffing game. It's a game about statistical analysis [I]and[/I] the telling of lies and guessing of tells. I think you're missing the pleasure of role-playing out how the player can succeed at this endeavor. Researching a spell doesn't need to be "roll a die". Nor working with your Order need be "tell me what your Order consists of", so you can "just say" a good explanation of your Paladin's success. This is the Skill Challenge irrationality all over again. Defining a part of the world so it makes sense with what has come before is a challenge, but it isn't a role-playing challenge. You can't define the world in order to win and still be winning at role-playing. This is what I meant by make-believe. [/QUOTE]

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