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<blockquote data-quote="RyvenCedrylle" data-source="post: 4548951" data-attributes="member: 66726">No, but this isn't a bad idea in theory.&nbsp; A simple addition to the 4E Skill Challenge that helps 'correct' their use (besides the now-vaunted mathematical issues) are FTW (For the Win)! and FTL (For the Loss)! conditions.&nbsp; These are automatic failures or victories that are completely based on player decisions rather than character skill.&nbsp; &nbsp;Example:&nbsp; Price HagglingTwo PCs enter an alchemist's shop looking for various magical and alchemical components.&nbsp; The PCs note, upon looking around, that the prices seem awfully steep!&nbsp; They engage the alchemist in some friendly roleplaying conversation before getting down to brass tacks.&nbsp;Win Conditions:Damage – none.&nbsp; Fighting him brings the town guard.Skill Challenge – 4/2&nbsp; DC 15 He is very proud of his store and will not take much crap from the PCs.FTW! - Name Dropping.&nbsp; Mentioning “(So-and-so) said you had a good setup here” from an appropiate NPC at the GM's judgement nets the win.FTL! - Insults or Attempted Theft &nbsp;Win – a 15% discountLose – a 10% markup; further argument results in being kicked out of the store&nbsp;Given that the players know these conditions exist, it provides a challenge for them to find the 'shortcut.'&nbsp; If the players fail, the characters can pick up the slack.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="RyvenCedrylle, post: 4548951, member: 66726"] No, but this isn't a bad idea in theory. A simple addition to the 4E Skill Challenge that helps 'correct' their use (besides the now-vaunted mathematical issues) are FTW (For the Win)! and FTL (For the Loss)! conditions. These are automatic failures or victories that are completely based on player decisions rather than character skill. Example: [FONT=Arial][I][COLOR=white]Price Haggling[/COLOR][/I][/FONT] [FONT=Arial][I][COLOR=white]Two PCs enter an alchemist's shop looking for various magical and alchemical components. The PCs note, upon looking around, that the prices seem awfully steep! They engage the alchemist in some friendly roleplaying conversation before getting down to brass tacks.[/COLOR][/I][/FONT] [FONT=Arial][I][COLOR=white] [/COLOR][/I][/FONT] [FONT=Arial][I][COLOR=white]Win Conditions:[/COLOR][/I][/FONT] [I][COLOR=white][U][FONT=Arial]Damage[/FONT][/U][FONT=Arial] – none. Fighting him brings the town guard.[/FONT][/COLOR][/I] [I][COLOR=white][U][FONT=Arial]Skill Challenge[/FONT][/U][FONT=Arial] – 4/2 DC 15 He is very proud of his store and will not take much crap from the PCs.[/FONT][/COLOR][/I] [I][COLOR=white][U][FONT=Arial]FTW! [/FONT][/U][FONT=Arial]- Name Dropping. Mentioning “(So-and-so) said you had a good setup here” from an appropiate NPC at the GM's judgement nets the win.[/FONT][/COLOR][/I] [I][COLOR=white][FONT=Arial][U]FTL![/U] - Insults or Attempted Theft [/FONT][/COLOR][/I] [FONT=Arial][I][COLOR=white] [/COLOR][/I][/FONT] [FONT=Arial][I][COLOR=white][/COLOR][/I][/FONT] [FONT=Arial][I][COLOR=white]Win – a 15% discount[/COLOR][/I][/FONT] [FONT=Arial][I][COLOR=white]Lose – a 10% markup; further argument results in being kicked out of the store[/COLOR][/I][/FONT] Given that the [I]players[/I] know these conditions exist, it provides a challenge for them to find the 'shortcut.' If the players fail, the characters can pick up the slack. [/QUOTE]

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