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<blockquote data-quote="RyvenCedrylle" data-source="post: 4549236" data-attributes="member: 66726">Mort -&nbsp;The term 'in theory' was supposed to cover the concept of a player acting out the character's action, not actually moving a couch. My apologies if I was too brief in my statement.&nbsp;The point has been made several times in other threads that much of the fun or difference between later D&amp;D and early D&amp;D has to do with who holds narrative and world-control. Early versions have the players controlling only their characters in the DM's world. 'Guess what the DM is thinking' is a standard MO for these editions if you stop and think about it. You tell the DM what you're doing and he (or she) tells you what happens. If there's a rumor of a hidden treasure in the last room of the dungeon, you must 'guess where the DM thought' to have placed it to find it. Roleplayed negotiations require you to 'guess what the DM thinks' will be a satisfactory position or offer.&nbsp;Later editions allow players to define facts and NPC's actions in the now shared gameworld (see the Fighter's &quot;Come and Get It&quot; or any 4E cleric trying to solve all skill challenges with Religion checks, for example) The DM doesn't need to decide where the treasure is in 3E or 4E - she just needs a DC for you to roll your Perception or Search against. You could even decide where it is so long as you pass the skill check. &nbsp;The FTW! and FTL! conditions recall some of that early DM-centric flavor for 4E Skill challenges. You're welcome to try to read the DM's mind to determine 'the right' (or 'a right') course of action to take. If not, you can still rely on your character's abilities to accrue enough successes to see you through.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="RyvenCedrylle, post: 4549236, member: 66726"] Mort - The term 'in theory' was supposed to cover the concept of a player acting out the character's action, not actually moving a couch. My apologies if I was too brief in my statement. The point has been made several times in other threads that much of the fun or difference between later D&D and early D&D has to do with who holds narrative and world-control. Early versions have the players controlling only their characters in the DM's world. 'Guess what the DM is thinking' is a standard MO for these editions if you stop and think about it. You tell the DM what you're doing and he (or she) tells you what happens. If there's a rumor of a hidden treasure in the last room of the dungeon, you must 'guess where the DM thought' to have placed it to find it. Roleplayed negotiations require you to 'guess what the DM thinks' will be a satisfactory position or offer. Later editions allow players to define facts and NPC's actions in the now shared gameworld (see the Fighter's "Come and Get It" or any 4E cleric trying to solve all skill challenges with Religion checks, for example) The DM doesn't need to decide where the treasure is in 3E or 4E - she just needs a DC for you to roll your Perception or Search against. You could even decide where it is so long as you pass the skill check. The FTW! and FTL! conditions recall some of that early DM-centric flavor for 4E Skill challenges. You're welcome to try to read the DM's mind to determine 'the right' (or 'a right') course of action to take. If not, you can still rely on your character's abilities to accrue enough successes to see you through. [/QUOTE]

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