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Message: <blockquote data-quote="DarthDiablo" data-source="post: 3748252" data-attributes="member: 55048">Good and Evil are more basic moral concepts that have been around as long as humans.  Law and Chaos, as someone else already pointed out, are more of a political concept.  Do you obey the law?  I'm sure most of us do.  Most of us break it too, whether it's speeding down the road, jaywalking or perhaps someother more serious crime.  We can get into a real long argument here about what is lawful and what isn't.  Take the girl in Ireland from about 5 years ago (I think-it made the news in North America anyway) who was impregnated by a rape and wanted an abortion.  Coming from a Roman Catholic community, it was illegal for her to do so and from what I recall she went ahead with the abortion (may have been in the States or England, I believe).  She did what she felt was for the greater good.  She was probably an otherwise law-abiding citizen.  Is she now chaotic because she broke a serious law in her homeland?  It's legal in other places!  But whether she is lawful or chaotic I bet through all of it she is a Good person , although some might argue the that what she did was Evil.  Most people consider the same things to be Good-helping others in need, or Evil-killing for personal gain or pleasure, no matter what part of the world you live in.  But what is lawful and what is not depend on what the local laws are.But enough of the real world, let's get back to the fantasy concept.  A great deal of the Law vs. Chaos ideology comes from Michael Moorcocks Elric series.  It has been a loooooong time since I read those books, but (correct ,me if I'm wrong) from what I recall the concepts were more Law=Good, Chaos=Evil.  If you want to run your campaign with a law vs. chaos dichotomy that's fine.  I just don't like the way the 9 alignment system shoehorns characters into a certain type of behavior.  Being morally Good, Evil or ambiguous/apathetic (Neutral) to me is more inherit in a person than Lawful/Chaotic.  To me it makes more sense to say your character is 1 of those 3-Good, Neutral or Evil.  There actions will usually be the same in most situations, (except the Neutral guy who can go either way).  Would a Paladin not help an innocent person in need because his High Cleric or King orderd it?  By the rules one way or the other he will be acting out of alignment.  By their good nature, in my eyes, the Paladin (they are based off heroic knights after all) would help the person, laws be damned, which would make it either a Neutral or Chaotic Good act.  Does that mean he is now at risk of losing his Paladin status?  Obviously Paladins follow a code (chivalry) that they adhere to, but the current rules force the character into following that code with little leeway.  The code should be followed because it's a part of that character, not because of the rules.  I.E. Paladins have to follow the code, but other LG characters don't have to, even though they may have near identical ideologies.  Lightening up by removing the law/chaos as alignment rules, and making them into guidlines would make the game better IMO.  Of course the same could be argued for Good & Evil, but really most fantasy is based off the concept of Good vs. Evil and the designers have already said they're not getting rid of alignment, just reworking it.</blockquote>

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