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<blockquote data-quote="Neonchameleon" data-source="post: 6452589" data-attributes="member: 87792">No.&nbsp; This is impossible in a specific and limited subset of cases.&nbsp; Tomb of Horrors is a specific and almost unique example of a dungeon (the only comparison I can think of is White Plume Mountain).&nbsp; If I turn up with e.g. Hoard of the Dragon Queen what you say is &quot;just impossible in most cases&quot; is not only not impossible; it is desirable.&nbsp; And that's even assuming I'm the sort of DM who only uses off the peg adventures; if I actually customise the adventures then of course I pitch.You play one specific style of D&amp;D.&nbsp; One in which you ensure that the PCs (and by extension the players) can know very little about the world.&nbsp; You yourself have admitted this. And your style might as well have been designed to make denying player agency workable.&nbsp; This works.&nbsp; It is just one style and in my experience very much a minority style.&nbsp; Please stop presenting it as the One True Way.And this works.&nbsp; Allowing the players to make up villages, merchant families, small local thieves guilds they've been exiled from, and other parts of the setting.&nbsp; All of which (a) are not in contradiction with the setting and (b) add to the richness of the setting.Not being able to contradict that which has already been established about the setting is normal in just about any style of play.Indeed.&nbsp; Not everyone does this.&nbsp; Some of us write our own.&nbsp; Some of us even write our own on the fly.&nbsp; Starting with a couple of thematic elements and an enemy and seeing what happens (for the record, this works much better in short campaigns).&nbsp; I've never bought a D&amp;D adventure that didn't make me want to hack it to pieces either.Hint: Everyone's role in the game is whatever that group treats it as.&nbsp; Stop treating your game as the One True Way.And I take this as proof positive that you have an adult/child relationship going on.&nbsp; In my experience the people most fun to play with will ask for things that make the game more entertaining - and frequently things that screw over their own characters badly.That's because you were fifteen.&nbsp; Seriously?&nbsp; Teenagers having power fantasies?&nbsp; I'm unsurprised.&nbsp; And yes, teenagers often get sent to their rooms (and adults sometimes need it).Alternatively you have collaborative character generation a la Apocalypse World.&nbsp; You then work together and what people want.&nbsp; And people all play off each others' ideas fairly often.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Neonchameleon, post: 6452589, member: 87792"] No. This is impossible [I]in a specific and limited subset of cases.[/I] Tomb of Horrors is a specific and almost unique example of a dungeon (the only comparison I can think of is White Plume Mountain). If I turn up with e.g. Hoard of the Dragon Queen what you say is "just impossible in most cases" is not only not impossible; it is desirable. And that's even assuming I'm the sort of DM who only uses off the peg adventures; if I actually customise the adventures then of course I pitch. You play one specific style of D&D. One in which you ensure that the PCs (and by extension the players) can know very little about the world. You yourself have admitted this. And your style might as well have been designed to make denying player agency workable. This works. It is just one style and in my experience very much a minority style. Please stop presenting it as the One True Way. And this works. Allowing the players to make up villages, merchant families, small local thieves guilds they've been exiled from, and other parts of the setting. All of which (a) are not in contradiction with the setting and (b) add to the richness of the setting. Not being able to contradict that which has already been established about the setting is normal in just about any style of play. Indeed. [B]Not everyone does this.[/B] Some of us write our own. Some of us even write our own [I]on the fly[/I]. Starting with a couple of thematic elements and an enemy and seeing what happens (for the record, this works much better in short campaigns). I've never bought a D&D adventure that didn't make me want to hack it to pieces either. Hint: Everyone's role in the game is whatever that group treats it as. Stop treating your game as the One True Way. And I take this as proof positive that you have an adult/child relationship going on. In my experience the people most fun to play with will ask for things that make the game more entertaining - and frequently things that screw over their own characters badly. That's because [I]you were fifteen.[/I] Seriously? Teenagers having power fantasies? I'm unsurprised. And yes, teenagers often get sent to their rooms (and adults sometimes need it). Alternatively you have collaborative character generation a la Apocalypse World. You then work together and what people want. And people all play off each others' ideas fairly often. [/QUOTE]

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