Charging and flyby attack

[Kershek]

Take, for example, a harpy 30 feet up in the trees. Would you allow the harpy to make a charge action by swooping down, attacking a creature on the ground with a flyby attack (no AoO), then swooping up 20 feet back up out of attack range as part of the charge? It's a straight line in 2d, just the height is different.

 

[Murrdox]

Technically, that would be a "Dive" not a "Charge". A dive doubles damage instead of adding +2 to your attack.

Dive doesn't require a feat to use - any flying creature can use it, and it can be combined with the Flyby Attack feat.

As for whether or not the Harpy is specifically capable of this action...

A Harpy has 80ft flight with average manuverability. She has to move at least 40 feet to stay in the air... no problem with this. The dive is 30 ft down to 5', so that's a 25' dive, during which she can move double her speed. She has no limitation on her dive angle, so it can be as steep as you like. After she dives, she has to move at 5' elevation for at least 5' before climbing again, at which point she has an upward angle of 60 degrees and half her speed. However, since she dove 25' at double speed, and has to move at least 40, she'll have more than enough movement left to get 30' back up in the air. The only question is really how much DISTANCE she is transversing.

In short, yes she can do this. Check out the flight manuverability table in the DMG. I took all the preceeding info off the SRD.

 

[Kershek]

Thanks for the excellent and thorough response. I didn't actually know abou the dive ability. I'll remember that next time they encounter a flying creature.

So, a harpy can't hover in the air? They have to always move at least 40' to stay afloat? If so, and they move 20', how much do they drop? 20'?

 

[Murrdox]

There is a Hover feat which many flying creatures possess that allow it to hover in midair. "Perfect" and "Good" flyers get the effects of this feat for free. Harpies don't have this feat, thus they always need to keep flying. The chart for flying manuverability says that flyers with "Average" manuverability need to move at least half of their movement to stay in the air. Here's the effects if they fail to maintain their speed.

Minimum Forward Speed: If a flying creature fails to maintain its minimum forward speed, it must land at the end of its movement. If it is too high above the ground to land, it falls straight down, descending 150 feet in the first round of falling. If this distance brings it to the ground, it takes falling damage. If the fall doesn’t bring the creature to the ground, it must spend its next turn recovering from the stall. It must succeed at a Reflex saving throw (DC 20) to recover. Otherwise it falls another 300 feet. If it hits the ground, it takes falling damage. Otherwise, it has another chance to recover on its next turn.

EDIT

Here's the Dive ability for ya.

Dive Attack [Full][AoO: Yes]
Description: Creatures that fly can make dive attacks.
A dive attack works just like a charge, but the diving creature must move a minimum of 30 feet. It can make only claw attacks, but these deal double damage.

 

[Spatzimaus]

Would you allow the harpy to make a charge action by swooping down, attacking a creature on the ground with a flyby attack (no AoO), then swooping up 20 feet back up out of attack range as part of the charge?

IIRC, while Spring Attack and Ride-By Attack prevent AoOs, Fly-By Attack doesn't. You'd take an AoO while you do this.

The difference is, Fly-By Attack lets you do non-attack things in that intermediate action. So, with Spring Attack it's only move-attack-move, with Fly-By it could be move-breath weapon-move or move-cast spell-move.

 

[Kershek]

Re: Re: Charging and flyby attack

IIRC, while Spring Attack and Ride-By Attack prevent AoOs, Fly-By Attack doesn't. You'd take an AoO while you do this.

Oops.

 

[Arcturus_Rugend]

Just an FYI. : There's an Improved Flyby feat in Sav. Spec. that lets you use avoid the AoO from Flyby if you use your extra partial action as an attack. So it functions as an aerial Spring Attack of sorts, but is more versatile with the possibility of using your partial for something different (though your opponent would still receive the AoO in this case).