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Message: <blockquote data-quote="steeldragons" data-source="post: 8467351" data-attributes="member: 92511">Arguably, "charm" spells (Friends, Charm Person, et al) are not "mind control" so much as mind/emotion/perception "influencing." You can not force them to harm themselves or do things that are intrinsically against their nature. The target knows they were ensorcelled when the spell wears off. It's a...mental "nudge." Is the bard or knightly- or warlordy-played battlemaster guy (some missionary or preachery paladin or cleric types) who "influence" you through inspiration or rallying calls or uplifting sermons (which tangibly change your rolls for the better or enemy rolls for the worse) "evil" for using those features? I presume you/reasonable people will say, "No, of course not." So my query, then, is, "Why not?"That can be contrasted with the other arm of Enchantment magics, everyone's favorites, the "compulsions." This is mind "control." You don't have a choice [if you fail the save]. You, generally, awaken from the spell with no knowledge of what you've done. The compulsions are your, arguably, intrinsically evil enchantments. While we look at Dominate as the quintessential example of this, it really starts waaaay back at 1st level, with the cleric's Command spell. Hold Person! Though, I believe, in both of those lower level cases you are aware of what you're doing/is happening to you. You just can't help it... makes it even more evil, if you ask me.Right out the gate, it's not the enchanters or the necromancers you need to watch and worry about being evil. It's those shifty pompous clerics.</blockquote>

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