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Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Chill touch vs Troll regeneration
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<blockquote data-quote="Paxanadu" data-source="post: 7025361" data-attributes="member: 55358"><p>You must be confusing the <em><u><strong>fluff</strong></u></em> part with the actual rule mechanic part, which is very clear:</p><p></p><p>Regeneration. The troll regains 10 hit points at the start of its</p><p>turn. If the troll takes acid or fire damage, this trait doesn't</p><p>function at the start of the troll's next turn. The troll dies only if</p><p>it starts its turn with 0 hit points and doesn't regenerate.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I like slaads too. They can make for a great campaign arc, once the players are beyond the typical goblins / orcs / etc. stage, but before the true epic stuff.</p><p></p><p>However, Chill Touch remains weak even then. Most Slaads would indeed be blue or red, and those wouldn't regenerate ANYWAY if brought down to 0 hp.</p><p></p><p>So typically, there is absolutely zero difference in outcome between A and B below:</p><p></p><p>A: Whole party gang up on one slaad, with a "Chill Touch" as a "finisher" (Ready action needed?).</p><p></p><p>B: Whole party gang up on one slaad, with ANY damaging spell another cantrip or whatever, anywhere in the turn order too.</p><p></p><p>So yeah, definitely not an argument that the cantrip is "too powerful".</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Another side-note that most people seem to miss: he healing prevention lasts only until the BEGINNING of your next turn.</p><p></p><p>This means an enemy cleric might ready a healing spell to go off "the next time that Chill Touch loving wizard tries something" ergo "after the start of the wizard's turn, but before he can complete another casting of Chill Touch".</p><p></p><p>While forcing an enemy that wants some healing to use a Ready action can be nice, it's nowhere near as powerful as COMPLETELY negating all healing. If a big baddie is super wounded and is going to cast Heal on himself for a true "second wind", he probably won't also try to move out of reach anyway, as normally that would provoke opportunity attacks, unless he ALSO has high maneouvrablity talents.</p><p></p><p>Villainous low-power healing is next to stupidly useless in a fight; when things go bad for the villain and he is losing, why would he try to heal for say 20 hit points, when the heroes all gang up on him and deal him over 60 damage per round? He might as well try to do one last evil action, curing himself would be way too anticlimatic. The *ONLY* way it's worth it is if the bad guy with it's single turn can cure himself of MORE damage than a full party entire round's worth of damage. This means SUPER STRONG healing we're talking Cure Wounds using a quite high spell slot here ! How often does the bad guy not only have access to high level healing, but is ALSO able to move out of melee without provoking opportunity attacks? So yeah using a Ready to heal back up isn't sch a sacrifice. *EVEN THEN* the bad guy would probably be better off doing something else anyway. The only way the healing tactic works is if the action economy is in your favor, such as a tank blocking off a corridor with the healer safely behind the tank and healing him, and there, again, moving around isn't needed.</p><p></p><p></p><p>So yeah Chill Touch's special benefit is easily bypassed with a Ready Action, thus isn't going to prevent magical healing based on actual spending of actions. Maybe the first time that it happens in a fight, but not afterwards. So it's mostly god vs the regenerating monsters, to quicken the fight by <strong><u><em>maybe</em></u></strong> half a round. </p><p></p><p></p><p>It's not overpowered at all.</p><p></p><p>I prefer it's anti-undead feature. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":-)" title="Smile :-)" data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":-)" /></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Paxanadu, post: 7025361, member: 55358"] You must be confusing the [I][U][B]fluff[/B][/U][/I] part with the actual rule mechanic part, which is very clear: Regeneration. The troll regains 10 hit points at the start of its turn. If the troll takes acid or fire damage, this trait doesn't function at the start of the troll's next turn. The troll dies only if it starts its turn with 0 hit points and doesn't regenerate. I like slaads too. They can make for a great campaign arc, once the players are beyond the typical goblins / orcs / etc. stage, but before the true epic stuff. However, Chill Touch remains weak even then. Most Slaads would indeed be blue or red, and those wouldn't regenerate ANYWAY if brought down to 0 hp. So typically, there is absolutely zero difference in outcome between A and B below: A: Whole party gang up on one slaad, with a "Chill Touch" as a "finisher" (Ready action needed?). B: Whole party gang up on one slaad, with ANY damaging spell another cantrip or whatever, anywhere in the turn order too. So yeah, definitely not an argument that the cantrip is "too powerful". Another side-note that most people seem to miss: he healing prevention lasts only until the BEGINNING of your next turn. This means an enemy cleric might ready a healing spell to go off "the next time that Chill Touch loving wizard tries something" ergo "after the start of the wizard's turn, but before he can complete another casting of Chill Touch". While forcing an enemy that wants some healing to use a Ready action can be nice, it's nowhere near as powerful as COMPLETELY negating all healing. If a big baddie is super wounded and is going to cast Heal on himself for a true "second wind", he probably won't also try to move out of reach anyway, as normally that would provoke opportunity attacks, unless he ALSO has high maneouvrablity talents. Villainous low-power healing is next to stupidly useless in a fight; when things go bad for the villain and he is losing, why would he try to heal for say 20 hit points, when the heroes all gang up on him and deal him over 60 damage per round? He might as well try to do one last evil action, curing himself would be way too anticlimatic. The *ONLY* way it's worth it is if the bad guy with it's single turn can cure himself of MORE damage than a full party entire round's worth of damage. This means SUPER STRONG healing we're talking Cure Wounds using a quite high spell slot here ! How often does the bad guy not only have access to high level healing, but is ALSO able to move out of melee without provoking opportunity attacks? So yeah using a Ready to heal back up isn't sch a sacrifice. *EVEN THEN* the bad guy would probably be better off doing something else anyway. The only way the healing tactic works is if the action economy is in your favor, such as a tank blocking off a corridor with the healer safely behind the tank and healing him, and there, again, moving around isn't needed. So yeah Chill Touch's special benefit is easily bypassed with a Ready Action, thus isn't going to prevent magical healing based on actual spending of actions. Maybe the first time that it happens in a fight, but not afterwards. So it's mostly god vs the regenerating monsters, to quicken the fight by [B][U][I]maybe[/I][/U][/B] half a round. It's not overpowered at all. I prefer it's anti-undead feature. :-) [/QUOTE]
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