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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Fanaelialae" data-source="post: 5762480" data-attributes="member: 53980">I don't think there's any winning this discussion because you're all correct (except that one guy; you know who you are <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> ).Hussar is right about all rpgs creating a story.  Even in a hack-and-slash, I could afterward write up what happened as an action heavy story about a group of murder hobos.  It wouldn't be the finest tale ever told, but it would be story.  As such, even a campaign that doesn't intend to make a story creates a story (albeit, not necessarily a very good one).Everyone opposing his position is also correct.  Just because an rpg has the side effect of creating a story during play, doesn't mean that that's the focus of every group.  Some groups, in fact, go out of their way to avoid constructs that appear too "story-like".Some people play to enjoy a series of (hack-and-slash) encounters (that isn't meant as an insult by the way; my group has done and enjoyed this kind of beer and pretzels game on occasion).  Others do it for a challenge; a kind of test of wits between the DM and his players.  There are groups that aren't interested in the creation of a story per se, but rather in immersing themselves as completely as possible in an imaginary setting, and exploring the implications thereof.  This last is similar to a story driven game in some respects, but the "goal" of play (being wholly immersed in the setting) is not the same as a story game (which seeks to emulate the structure of a fantasy novel).  An immersive game may actively seek to avoid certain constructs that are readily accepted (as with all good things, in moderation) in a story game, such as the deus ex machina.Seeing as how the end-goal of playing rpgs is fun (except perhaps for masochists <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> ) none of these styles is objectively better than the other.  The thing that matters most is that everyone enjoys themselves.  This can be challenging when not everyone enjoys the same style of play, but in my experience it's rare to find a game that focuses exclusively on one style or another.  Even a hack-and-slash can have immersive interludes, for example.Neither "side" is wrong.  They're merely two different perspectives about the same thing.  Someone standing on a cliff will describe a shipwrecked boat differently than someone looking at the boat from under the water, but that doesn't mean that either will ever be able to prove the other objectively wrong.</blockquote>

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