Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 6362191" data-attributes="member: 42582">I think it's likely that casters will be using their spells, yes. That's what they have them for!And the OP factored in the number of rounds of combat, number of spells cast, etc.It depends on what other spells are available. Suppose Sleep is, for instance, then the wizard might do pretty well.But furthermore, you seem to be focusing mostly on combat. The wizard's power, it seems to me, is mostly in the non-combat sphere. The fact that the wizard is also competitive with the fighter in combat strike me in itself as a mark of potential imbalance.A 1st level fighter can shove one target no more than 1 size category larger 5' with an opposed check, forgoing the chance to do damage.A 1st level wizard can do Thunderwave, an AoE that does 2d8 damage (ie comparable to the fighter's damage on a hit), and still does half damage on a successful save, and if the save is failed can push the targets 10' regardless of their size.It seems to me that the wizard is going to be doing the bulk of the forced movement: AoE plus auto-damage, whereas the fighter has to forgo damage altogether to have a chance to push one, size-limited target.I don't see how improvisation is going to compensate for that. The whole context of [MENTION=45197]pming[/MENTION]'s example - a fighter with a rake in a bar, rather than (say) with frost giants on the ledges of the Glacial Rift - to me at least reinforces that a fighter's &quot;special moves&quot; are not in the same league as a caster's.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="pemerton, post: 6362191, member: 42582"] I think it's likely that casters will be using their spells, yes. That's what they have them for! And the OP factored in the number of rounds of combat, number of spells cast, etc. It depends on what other spells are available. Suppose Sleep is, for instance, then the wizard might do pretty well. But furthermore, you seem to be focusing mostly on combat. The wizard's power, it seems to me, is mostly in the non-combat sphere. The fact that the wizard is also competitive with the fighter in combat strike me in itself as a mark of potential imbalance. A 1st level fighter can shove one target no more than 1 size category larger 5' with an opposed check, forgoing the chance to do damage. A 1st level wizard can do Thunderwave, an AoE that does 2d8 damage (ie comparable to the fighter's damage on a hit), and still does half damage on a successful save, and if the save is failed can push the targets 10' regardless of their size. It seems to me that the wizard is going to be doing the bulk of the forced movement: AoE plus auto-damage, whereas the fighter has to forgo damage altogether to have a chance to push one, size-limited target. I don't see how improvisation is going to compensate for that. The whole context of [MENTION=45197]pming[/MENTION]'s example - a fighter with a rake in a bar, rather than (say) with frost giants on the ledges of the Glacial Rift - to me at least reinforces that a fighter's "special moves" are not in the same league as a caster's. [/QUOTE]

Verification