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Message: <blockquote data-quote="tyrlaan" data-source="post: 4772571" data-attributes="member: 20998">Ok, now I follow you, and agree. Most martial classes were indeed very similar in design.True for Earthdawn RAW, but out of control outside of RAW. I guess I was thinking beyond RAW and wasn't clear about it. Though I think it was mostly true because of the limited power options and general re-use of powers vs. invention of new ones, so new classes were just an amalgam of established abilities. The answer to your question is hidden in your complaint <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />Seriously though, what did you do in other games? If you needed a tribal shaman NPC you likely fleshed out a druid and then perhaps tweaked it a bit. If you wanted a holy warrior for the god of storms, how did you build it out? Probably a cleric focused on combat spells or perhaps a barbarian with some tweaks.My point is all the shticks already existed or could have existed in prior editions of D&D. The difference is 4e defines them as their own distinct entities. So instead of using fighter for every armored melee combatant NPC you make, 4e provides mechanical alternatives for various fighter (referring to the 3e fighter here) sub-niches. It was all there before, they just spell it out now.I agree with you, but not for the same reasons <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> I'm just not content with the limitations role and power selections place on how a given class can be played. From a world design/fluff perspective I think the many distinct classes work just fine, as I tried to express above. But for me personally, I'd prefer to be able to play a ranged warlord or a cleric with trickery spells, etc.</blockquote>

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