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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Chaosmancer" data-source="post: 9116123" data-attributes="member: 6801228">Most of which is just your insistence that I'm speaking nonsense and your refusal to take anything I say seriously, instead resorting to strawmen and personal attacks.For example, you don't like my answers, therefor you have used your crystal ball to scy and determine that I must not have examined anything, because you don't like that I disagree with you.And your position is "one person out of 40,000 said there was a problem, so a decade of survey research done by professionals must be horribly flawed!" One person making a claim is not evidence, as we have discussed. And yes, a company with the size and skilled staff like WoTC probably did something as basic as implement quality control measures on their survey. That is such a basic function of running a business that uses surveys that the idea they didn't do so requires rock-solid, undeniable evidence to the contrary. Not "that guy said" and a lot of "but my opinion on their real goals is".No, you need to differentiate between them because they are different. And, if WoTC is only planning on putting out designs that are popular, why on this green earth would I even be able to find examples of them putting out unpopular designs?!Well designed things... that aren't popular... not getting in... ISN'T evidence that WoTC cares more about popular designs than well-made designs.... wut?You either fundamentally misunderstand the discussion, or you don't care and are just twisting and conflating words to try and "win". I really wish I knew which, because this is exhausting. That was not my claim, my claim and the idea that WoTC is using the data to decide what to include, what to work on, and what to abandon are not mutually exclusive. The fact you think they are shows how deeply you misunderstand my position.How about because over the past decade they have not released a commercial product using these surveys that has done poorly? How about that for evidence? Because if they weren't getting the answers to the questions they were seeking, then how have they consistently succeeded? I've explained to you already that you are conflating this idea of "well designed" with "popular" and assuming that because they are asking for popularity, they are not getting the information they need to reach a design goal of "well designed". You just seem to refuse to even consider that you are wrong about their goals.No. Good does not equal popular. Not even close. That is an absurd statement. It is literally a logical fallacy. The Appeal to Popularity Fallacy. And now you want to claim a balanced design is not a good design?!4e was an incredibly designed game with some of the best lore in the entire history of Dungeons and Dragons, it absolutely supports my points. Also, AGAIN since the last time you brought this up, the two subclasses that were in the 20's? THEY DID NOT GO THROUGH THE SURVEY PROCESS! You can't claim that something that failed without going through the process is a sign that the process fails.</blockquote>

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