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<blockquote data-quote="Puggins" data-source="post: 4071227" data-attributes="member: 12386">In all honesty, how many rogues has everyone played in 3.x that didn't have Hide and Move Silently maxxed out?&nbsp; Sure, such characters exist, but they're in a rather small minority.&nbsp; In other words, for people that really want to play a Dwarven Trap Expert, the rogue is not the greatest fit.&nbsp; But hell, the 3.x rogue was just as bad a fit- why the hell does a trap expert have sneak attack if he doesn't know a thing about stealth?&nbsp; Ergo- wait for a more appropriate class to come down the pipeline in order to get a 100% fit, or deal with a 70% fit, or do a bit of retrofitting (Mearls said such a thing willl be simple).The weapon proficiencies don't bother me, though I wish the sap had been included.&nbsp; The list of weapons is perfectly appropriate for a character who is looking to end the combat as quickly as possible and has very little actual weapons training.&nbsp; The rapier, for those not familiar with it, requires extensive training to use correctly, and is utterly impractical in the context of ambushes.And making razor-precise attacks with a shuriken, sling or long bow?&nbsp; Err.... no.&nbsp; At least not in the middle of combat.Personally I would have liked to see a couple weapons added, but the list as-is makes perfect sense.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Puggins, post: 4071227, member: 12386"] In all honesty, how many rogues has everyone played in 3.x that didn't have Hide and Move Silently maxxed out? Sure, such characters exist, but they're in a rather small minority. In other words, for people that really want to play a Dwarven Trap Expert, the rogue is not the greatest fit. But hell, the 3.x rogue was just as bad a fit- why the hell does a trap expert have sneak attack if he doesn't know a thing about stealth? Ergo- wait for a more appropriate class to come down the pipeline in order to get a 100% fit, or deal with a 70% fit, or do a bit of retrofitting (Mearls said such a thing willl be simple). The weapon proficiencies don't bother me, though I wish the sap had been included. The list of weapons is perfectly appropriate for a character who is looking to end the combat as quickly as possible and has very little actual weapons training. The rapier, for those not familiar with it, requires extensive training to use correctly, and is utterly impractical in the context of ambushes. And making razor-precise attacks with a shuriken, sling or long bow? Err.... no. At least not in the middle of combat. Personally I would have liked to see a couple weapons added, but the list as-is makes perfect sense. [/QUOTE]

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