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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Mephista" data-source="post: 6631081" data-attributes="member: 6786252">That's because it IS a waste of time.   In some cases there's a clear issue, but other times?   I find that Arcane Trickster is far and away better than the Thief as a subclass.  Its laughable that we can try and claim one thing or another when so much depends on how the GM runs things now.    Skills are more important than spells in a lot of games, while other games tend to let spellcasters get away with a lot.   I think that there is an issue with some of the spell-and-sword sub/classes that never got ironed out right, other than the Paladin and Arcane Trickster, making it better to be either a full martial character, or a full spellcaster instead of hybrid*.  The Help action mostly replaces the need for buffing spells with skill checks in a lot of cases, with only a handful of spells that do better.   The tier system was originally developed when we had some classes that were clearly superior to others.  Cleric could AoE and utility as well as the wizard and the druid.   The rogue and fighters, meanwhile, were left in the dust with their meager, non-magic skills not keeping up with their magical counterparts, where low level spells replaced the need for skill checks, and spells made swords redundant.    In 5e, great pains were taken so that you couldn't replace a skill with a spell.   There was need for STR and DEX checks that a wizard couldn't literally hand wave away.   A Land Druid, Diviner Wizard, Life Cleric, and Red Dragon Sorcerer party simply can't cover the same situations that a Fighter or Barbarian fill in.  One class isn't superior to the other, because all of them have different niches they cover that's necessary.   So, the tier system flat out doesn't work that way.There are some builds that are  better than others, yes.   But ranking classes is doomed to failure because the needs of the game are so different.</blockquote>

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