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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Luke" data-source="post: 1182678" data-attributes="member: 602">I appreciate that post, Soulcatcher. I feel a warmer tone there.I also agree that proceeding along polite grounds is the way to go.I don't, however, agree with the "go open source or we shame you" approach, though.PCGen is a significant piece of work, but it certainly has its limitations, being based on a Java SDK, in terms of interface, amount of RAM required and other things.I'm not sure how many different programs you've looked at with regard to combat tracking, but I can tell you that (using an example I know), there's a whole stack of quality, integrated features in RolePlayingMaster that just wouldn't work (speed, RAM etc) on the average PC - if it ran on a Java SDK. Just check out the new wordprocessing features in it to get an idea of what I mean.Please, the point is not about "my app is better than yours". The point is about people having the flexibility to choose an app that gives them the features, power and quality that they feel they need.Open source material should stand on its own quality. I personally don't believe in an open source effort monpolizing control of information to enforce the use a companion open source application.As far as I understand it, no other commercial programs are built around "swooping on PCGen data". They're simply talking about an option for people to use additional data that they (typically) will purchase from CMP. I think that the real point has been missed (and side-stepped in your reply). The real issue is actually about other software being able to legally make Wizards splatbook data available to users of their software.The effort and hours people have put in is then not an issue. The people who did the work on that data get *paid* for it, and those who end up using the data *pay* them for it. So where's the problem?Personally, I wouldn't be interested in importing PCGen data to RolePlayingMaster. It would probably take me more effort to try and convert it, than to enter it in my own format from scratch. I have nice editors for entering game data. I would still come up short, since I need more than PCGen has in it to support my full in-game stuff.That leaves me (and other programs) with an issue of how to make Wizards splat data easily available legally. Since Wizards have only talked to CMP, who are only doing ETools and PCGen, thats where other software needs to look.I think you'll probably find that Chris' interest in PCGen is pretty much as a legal source of Wizards splat data in XML format.On the point of swoopers making money: I recall all the major RPG shareware developers (myself included) stating a while ago that the effort we pour into our programs is about a passion for RPG, and that if it was about making money, we'd be better off doing something else with our time. Chris (TwinRose) was silent on that issue, and that's his business.If you look at D20 publishers, there are those that produce open content, and those that produce closed content.I don't see any effort from the open D20 publishers to shame or strenuously encourage commercial D20 publishers into going open source. I don't think things should be any different with software.Ultimately, the RPG public should be left to decide what they like, and what they are prepared to pay for. If PCGen/GMGen meets their needs, is better than commercial stuff, and is free - well, everyone will be using it!Finally, I can tell you that the principals of the greatest open source project - Linux, are **not** poor people - and can thank Linux for that. I can also tell you that Sun's great (open) Java initiative (upon which PCGen/GmGen is completely dependant) was also very much about making money. A few years ago, serious Java initiatives in business usually required the purchase of very expensive multi-processor sun boxes.Yes, Java helps sell Sun boxes.With another great open source initiative, PCGen, the principals worked hard for a right from Wizards to incorporate the splat book data. Guess what? They're now running a commercial business selling those datasets, that came to them as an opportunity due to their positions as principals of an open source project!!!On a much smaller scale, the components I use to develop RPM are *not* cheap. Things have to be paid for.Not being tied to whatever the Java SDK has to offer costs me, but it also gives me much greater flexibility with the quality I have to offer the RPG community (assuming I'm happy to be Windows-only).Good Luck,</blockquote>

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