Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Thanee" data-source="post: 1805377" data-attributes="member: 478">Yeah, but I just fail to see how the presence of another opponent should make this easier. If anything, Cleave should just give an extra attack every round then, the hard training and all that. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />Your usual argument. It isn't too great, so every mechanical advantage is good. That's fine, but it's very far from what I meant.Cleave is the "extension" of a successful attack, which needed only very little of your power to execute it, so to say, and this can be carried on against another target. It's still "the same attack", however (not mechanically, of course). An AoO is a limited attack, which cannot be used against other targets, but the one, that provoked it, thus, even if you could use "this" attack against someone else, it would be useless.I can only guess you see Cleave as a kind of rejuvenation after such a successful attack, which dropped a creature, so you actually gain a completely new attack (still not mechanically speaking). In that case cleaving off AoO works fine, of course.It is not really only a matter of how Cleave works, but also a matter of how AoO work. To me AoO is a limited attack, not a regular attack like any other. It is completely not under your control and thus anything spawned off it, should inherit the same attributes (much like Cleave lets you inherit the same attack bonus, a hint, that it is actually meant to be the extension of the very same attack - I'm just taking it further here).It's a difference in projection, modeling the situation with the rules mechanics. That's all. I don't agree with this particular part of the rules, therefore I change it. Simple. There's nothing to argue whether it is good or bad, that's just one opinion or the other. Its effect is marginal enough to be ignorable, anyways, as long as you have your 16-ton weights ready for the players trying to abuse it. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />ByeThanee</blockquote>

Verification