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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Hypersmurf" data-source="post: 1601212" data-attributes="member: 1656">Actually, in the case of Cleave, I disagree fairly emphatically <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />If my Paladin-Sorcerer uses his True Strike as he Smites the evil hobgoblin he's flanking with his Goblinbane longsword from the back of his trusty horse, then Cleaves into the Dire Wolf on the other side...His initial bonus is:+5 BAB +3 Str+1 Weapon Focus+1 Enhancement+2 Bane enhancement+20 True Strike+4 Smite Evil+2 Flanking+1 Higher GroundTotal +39His bonus on the Cleave... well, the wolf isn't a goblinoid, so the +2 from Bane doesn't apply.  It's Large, so there's no higher ground bonus for striking from the back of a horse.  He's not flanking the wolf - his ally's way over the other side.  His True Strike and Smite Evil only apply to a single attack, so they've been used up (and besides, the wolf isn't evil).So his bonus on the Cleave:+5 BAB +3 Str+1 Weapon Focus+1 EnhancementTotal +10"at the same bonus" contrasts with other feats which allow you an extra attack "at your highest base attack bonus".  If I Cleave with my third iterative attack, I add +1 for BAB, not +11.  That's the 'same bonus' referred to.The 3E FAQ stated specifically that True Strike does not apply to the Cleave attack, so we can see that the Cleave uses the same bonus... with all applicable modifiers.  A lot of the modifiers to the initial attack are not applicable in this case.  We could also have some modifiers to the Cleave attack that did not apply to the initial attack.All that, of course, is completely separate to the original question.  I wouldn't even allow a bow to be used as an improvised melee weapon at all, let alone on a Cleave off killing someone with an arrow...-Hyp.</blockquote>

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