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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Thia Halmades" data-source="post: 2684848" data-attributes="member: 35863">To sum up:- Warning them about undead and then not switching up your enemy roster is what got you greased; IMO, your problem was fixable, but needed tweaking.  You went Vampire and stayed the course, which means the PCs were rewarded for putting two & two together and going full bore.  Try demons.  They don't give a **** how good your turn is. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f60e.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":cool:" title="Cool    :cool:"  data-smilie="6"data-shortname=":cool:" />- ed: you bring up an interesting point about Spontaeous Identifies, but that's not all that bad, and if someone is smart enough to use Div as a base, more power to them.  They can still mem it X times per day if they choose and then Spon. Cast. under the current system.  Immediate access doesn't break Clerics.- ed: Your idea about changing up Domain powers isn't a bad one, and again, this goes back to making a Clerics domains actually important.  However (love that word.  However.  Like how it sort of hangs there.)  However (oooh...) I don't now if you want to rebuild all of the mechanics from the ground up.  Why not bolster their affinity with a direct mechanic, and give the player more reasons to look for plants and plant types.  I'm sure there are all sorts of giant chunky Plantimals that could be summoned with some creative editing of the summon nature's ally list.- Diplomacy is one of the deadliest skills out there; I don't think you want your players talking down your boss MOB mid-fight, and that's the very first thing I see happening.  Have you ever seen a Boss blow a Will Save?  It's ugly.  It's VERY ugly.- DamionW: Hello!  Your problem is a bit more specific, and for your campaign I would outright recommend flipping out 'cure' for 'channel elemental energy' and thus the Cleric automatically has their pre-set domain (Element) and then selects (one?) additional domain, which can never be their elemental opposite domain.  Because in your setting Water = Healing, you'll have specific groups of Clerics with specific abilities & objectives.  Having a Water Cleric in the party becomes fundamentally different from having a Fire Cleric in the Party.  Water Clerics would have Water & Healing as auto-domains.  Fire may have Fire & Destruction.Wendy's.  Yum.</blockquote>

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