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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Xetheral" data-source="post: 8194806" data-attributes="member: 6802765">I'd word it slightly differently: the dispute is over whether the height of a climb is among the types of factors that the rules permit (rather than necessitate) the DM to call for a Strength (Athletics) check.But that aside, even if it were true that there is some objective sense in which only one of our perspectives can be correct, we have no way to determine which of our readings is the correct one. You're among the posters I most respect on this forum, and knowing that you disagree with my reading is enough for me to consider the question disputed. I still think my reading of the text is the stronger one, but I'm not going to assert that you're going outside the rules when the rules themselves are in dispute.I think that's why I'm reacting negatively when you do so: by claiming that others are going outside the rules, it sounds like you're not willing to concede even the validity of the other posters' contrary opinions, even as they are conceding the validity of your opinion.That's a worthwhile distinction to make. I would go even farther, however: my argument (taken to a greater level of nuance than I've previously expressed) is that it is up to each DM to decide whether a particular complication shares enough qualities with the example complications as requiring a Strength (Athletics) check. My impression is that you think the decision should instead be made in comparison to an implicit objective standard?(For clarity, yes, I think that if a DM determines that complication X shares enough qualities with the examples, the rules explicitly permit/encourage that DM to call for a Strength (Athletics) check, even if you or I think that DM is being silly. I did not mean to imply that a DM who identifies the day of the week as a climbing complication was being reasonable, only that I think they would still following the specific climbing rules when they accordingly called for a check.)</blockquote>

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