Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Combat Against Player Engagement: A Systemic Challenge
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Jacob Lewis" data-source="post: 9777682" data-attributes="member: 6667921"><p>Exactly—and that’s the distinction that matters. Systems like <em>Dungeon World</em> or <em>Daggerheart</em> are built to reward narrative reactivity. The GM’s “offer an opportunity” or the use of spotlights is baked into their core feedback loops.</p><p></p><p>What I’m talking about isn’t importing those systems into D&D or rewriting how CR or reactions work. It’s closer to a behavioral shift for the GM: recognizing narrative openings that already exist in play and allowing players to step into them without mechanical invocation. It’s not a house rule so much as a flexible interpretation of the scene.</p><p></p><p>In other words, D&D doesn’t need to become <em>Dungeon World</em> to capture a little of that energy. It just needs GMs to lean into narrative cause and effect when the moment calls for it, rather than defaulting to the turn sequence as the only valid time for agency.</p><p></p><p>The systems you mentioned, though, touch on something we hadn’t discussed yet—getting more results from every turn taken.</p><p></p><p>In D&D, every turn <em>could</em> move the narrative forward by showing the result of a character’s actions. The caveat is that progress often depends on success. If a character makes an attack and misses, nothing happens. The only real consequence of failure is that the clock extends and everyone waits longer for resolution. The turn is effectively wasted.</p><p></p><p>This, I think, is the core lesson games like <em>Dungeon World</em> and <em>Daggerheart</em> learned early: the story economy can’t afford wasted turns. In <em>Dungeon World</em>, the world responds to player actions regardless of success or failure—every roll changes something. That effectively folds the “adversary turn” into the same action, maintaining flow and keeping the fiction alive.</p><p></p><p><em>Daggerheart</em> achieves a similar result through flexibility. Dice outcomes ripple across the table, and both GMs and players are empowered to invite participation between turns. The design makes it harder for anyone to disengage because the story keeps moving even when the mechanics pause. More importantly, both systems respect the players’ time and active presence at the table.</p><p></p><p>Just to clarify: when I refer to “narrative,” I don’t just mean the overarching story or campaign arc—it’s the story within the combat itself. We often see fights through the lens of gamers: exchanges of blows until one side falls. Even when we add dynamic terrain or shifting objectives, we can miss that each combat is its own story of immediate struggle—of position, risk, and evolving intent. Each turn, successful or not, should contribute to that unfolding tension beyond “Is it my turn yet?” or “How much longer is this going to take?”</p><p></p><p>When systems or GMs structure combat around that continuous narrative flow—when player actions naturally provoke the world’s reactions in real time—engagement becomes self-sustaining. Expediting resolution by merging cause and effect into the same moment, as these systems do, keeps players proactive and emotionally tethered to the scene. They’re not waiting for the game to come back around to them; the story is already happening <em>with</em> them.</p><p></p><p>That’s the bridge back to my essay’s argument: engagement issues aren’t always fixed by speeding up rounds or tightening mechanics, but by designing (or running) systems where every turn meaningfully contributes to the evolving story. When momentum and consequence are unified, even failure serves the narrative—and no one at the table is left waiting for their chance to matter.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Jacob Lewis, post: 9777682, member: 6667921"] Exactly—and that’s the distinction that matters. Systems like [I]Dungeon World[/I] or [I]Daggerheart[/I] are built to reward narrative reactivity. The GM’s “offer an opportunity” or the use of spotlights is baked into their core feedback loops. What I’m talking about isn’t importing those systems into D&D or rewriting how CR or reactions work. It’s closer to a behavioral shift for the GM: recognizing narrative openings that already exist in play and allowing players to step into them without mechanical invocation. It’s not a house rule so much as a flexible interpretation of the scene. In other words, D&D doesn’t need to become [I]Dungeon World[/I] to capture a little of that energy. It just needs GMs to lean into narrative cause and effect when the moment calls for it, rather than defaulting to the turn sequence as the only valid time for agency. The systems you mentioned, though, touch on something we hadn’t discussed yet—getting more results from every turn taken. In D&D, every turn [I]could[/I] move the narrative forward by showing the result of a character’s actions. The caveat is that progress often depends on success. If a character makes an attack and misses, nothing happens. The only real consequence of failure is that the clock extends and everyone waits longer for resolution. The turn is effectively wasted. This, I think, is the core lesson games like [I]Dungeon World[/I] and [I]Daggerheart[/I] learned early: the story economy can’t afford wasted turns. In [I]Dungeon World[/I], the world responds to player actions regardless of success or failure—every roll changes something. That effectively folds the “adversary turn” into the same action, maintaining flow and keeping the fiction alive. [I]Daggerheart[/I] achieves a similar result through flexibility. Dice outcomes ripple across the table, and both GMs and players are empowered to invite participation between turns. The design makes it harder for anyone to disengage because the story keeps moving even when the mechanics pause. More importantly, both systems respect the players’ time and active presence at the table. Just to clarify: when I refer to “narrative,” I don’t just mean the overarching story or campaign arc—it’s the story within the combat itself. We often see fights through the lens of gamers: exchanges of blows until one side falls. Even when we add dynamic terrain or shifting objectives, we can miss that each combat is its own story of immediate struggle—of position, risk, and evolving intent. Each turn, successful or not, should contribute to that unfolding tension beyond “Is it my turn yet?” or “How much longer is this going to take?” When systems or GMs structure combat around that continuous narrative flow—when player actions naturally provoke the world’s reactions in real time—engagement becomes self-sustaining. Expediting resolution by merging cause and effect into the same moment, as these systems do, keeps players proactive and emotionally tethered to the scene. They’re not waiting for the game to come back around to them; the story is already happening [I]with[/I] them. That’s the bridge back to my essay’s argument: engagement issues aren’t always fixed by speeding up rounds or tightening mechanics, but by designing (or running) systems where every turn meaningfully contributes to the evolving story. When momentum and consequence are unified, even failure serves the narrative—and no one at the table is left waiting for their chance to matter. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Combat Against Player Engagement: A Systemic Challenge
Top