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<blockquote data-quote="ObsidianCrane" data-source="post: 4371218" data-attributes="member: 54918"><p>All that controlling does plenty, its about the way the effects work to help out the rest of the party.</p><p></p><p>Round 1 Legion's Hold - Hit: average 28 damage (11 dice+8Int+6Orb+3) and stunned. Miss: average 14 damage and target dazed.</p><p></p><p>Stunned and Dazed Opponents grant Combat Advantage - so everyone who attacks before the monsters save gets +2 to hit for attacks including you. Stunned critters cannot act. Dazed critters can take a standard, move or minor action only (ie any 1 action).</p><p></p><p>So the Rogue in particular should really wail on something for a round. Possibly even burning an AP to get another action (say Assassin's Point followed up immediately by Hurricane of Blood 7[w] + 10d8 + Dex followed by 5[W]+Dex). A Fighter can also abuse these poor unfortunates by going Reaper's Stance, AP: Warrior's Urgning, Cruel Reaper (a potential 6W+3x(Str+6), plus 10 ongoing, and 1[W] each round until they get away)</p><p></p><p>Round 2 - Crushing Titans Fist - Hit: 30 damage on average and target immobilized. Depending on what you are fighting either keep or dismiss the effect.</p><p></p><p>While immobilization doesn't automatically cause combat advantage the fact the enemy cannot move means its easy for the party to set it up, and the Reaper's Stance goes off for the fighter yielding 10 ongoing + 1[w] damage for each creature he urged closer.</p><p></p><p>Round 3 Spend AP - Storm Cage Hit:46 average damage, Greater Ice Storm (Archmage -> Encounter) Hit: 50 average damage and immobilize.</p><p></p><p>Again all those immobilized guys can trigger the Reaper's Stance, and because they are not moving its easy for the rogue to flank again.</p><p></p><p>You've now done 154 damage to multiple opponents and pretty much kept them out of the fight or hindered at least for 3 rounds. </p><p></p><p>At the same time each other PC should have done that much damage or more to one or two of the creatures (note the fighter starting with a potential average of 84 damage to all enemies, and the rogue into the 100-120 range with the first round)</p><p></p><p>(Oh and Melee guys like Fighters and Rogues get a better average damage by using Gauntlets of Destruction (especially rogues and TWF Rangers).)</p><p></p><p>So that's about 3 rounds only looking at 3 PCs for their damage, each has used 3 Encounters and 1 daily. At this point one or two enemies are probably down just from sustained fire of these 3 and the enemies might well be standing there being punching bags due to the Wizard's effects, an effect compounded by adding other PCs.</p><p></p><p>I also notice that you describe 3 seperate encounters, so I have to wonder if you played through all 3 of those encounters before you were reduced to "bashing away with at wills" or if you were getting to the "bashing away with at wills" with just the first encounter?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="ObsidianCrane, post: 4371218, member: 54918"] All that controlling does plenty, its about the way the effects work to help out the rest of the party. Round 1 Legion's Hold - Hit: average 28 damage (11 dice+8Int+6Orb+3) and stunned. Miss: average 14 damage and target dazed. Stunned and Dazed Opponents grant Combat Advantage - so everyone who attacks before the monsters save gets +2 to hit for attacks including you. Stunned critters cannot act. Dazed critters can take a standard, move or minor action only (ie any 1 action). So the Rogue in particular should really wail on something for a round. Possibly even burning an AP to get another action (say Assassin's Point followed up immediately by Hurricane of Blood 7[w] + 10d8 + Dex followed by 5[W]+Dex). A Fighter can also abuse these poor unfortunates by going Reaper's Stance, AP: Warrior's Urgning, Cruel Reaper (a potential 6W+3x(Str+6), plus 10 ongoing, and 1[W] each round until they get away) Round 2 - Crushing Titans Fist - Hit: 30 damage on average and target immobilized. Depending on what you are fighting either keep or dismiss the effect. While immobilization doesn't automatically cause combat advantage the fact the enemy cannot move means its easy for the party to set it up, and the Reaper's Stance goes off for the fighter yielding 10 ongoing + 1[w] damage for each creature he urged closer. Round 3 Spend AP - Storm Cage Hit:46 average damage, Greater Ice Storm (Archmage -> Encounter) Hit: 50 average damage and immobilize. Again all those immobilized guys can trigger the Reaper's Stance, and because they are not moving its easy for the rogue to flank again. You've now done 154 damage to multiple opponents and pretty much kept them out of the fight or hindered at least for 3 rounds. At the same time each other PC should have done that much damage or more to one or two of the creatures (note the fighter starting with a potential average of 84 damage to all enemies, and the rogue into the 100-120 range with the first round) (Oh and Melee guys like Fighters and Rogues get a better average damage by using Gauntlets of Destruction (especially rogues and TWF Rangers).) So that's about 3 rounds only looking at 3 PCs for their damage, each has used 3 Encounters and 1 daily. At this point one or two enemies are probably down just from sustained fire of these 3 and the enemies might well be standing there being punching bags due to the Wizard's effects, an effect compounded by adding other PCs. I also notice that you describe 3 seperate encounters, so I have to wonder if you played through all 3 of those encounters before you were reduced to "bashing away with at wills" or if you were getting to the "bashing away with at wills" with just the first encounter? [/QUOTE]
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