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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Edena_of_Neith" data-source="post: 2765214" data-attributes="member: 2020">I'm looking at the Bardic Music abilities.  What do they mean by su and sp (after words like countersong, fascinate, etc.) ?  Are they referring to supernatural and spell-like ability?  I know that like bonuses do not stack in 3rd edition.  Different kinds of bonuses do stack.  There seems to be a lot of different kinds of bonuses.  So far, I've heard of, for Armor Class alone:  Armor bonus  Shield bonus  Dexterity bonus (which can be cancelled out by the type of armor worn)  Enhancement bonus (I do not entire understand what enhancement means)  Deflection bonus (I do not entirely understand that one either, despite the obvious meaning of the word deflection.)  Dodge bonus (I think I got that one down ...)  Morale bonus  Competency bonus (LOL ... you can add to your competency in defending yourself!)  Situational bonus (being on lower ground, prone, etc.)  Exalted bonus (I think, and I don't know anything more about it)  Any other types of bonuses?  (You may not be able to stack, but there are things out there they never had in 2E, for you to use instead.  And it was quite rare that 2E DMs let you stack armor (plate armor with chain mail underneath??) and magical items were rare (Yes, I saw the + 5 cloak, + 5 armor, + 5 ring, + 5 shield, high dexterity approach, but I think you can do better than that in 3.5E, even without stacking.)  Concerning the Bardic Music:  Countersong is pretty clear.  I remember that from 1st and 2nd edition.  I think I know what a Perform Check is, too.  Roll 1d20.  Add Charisma modifier.  Add rating in Perform.  A 1st level bard could have a Rank of 4 in Perform, so if he did you'd add 4.  So I roll a ... 10.  Add 3 for the bard's 17 Charisma.  Add 4 for his Perform level.  That equals 17.  That is the saving throw mentioned that creatures can use, if it is higher than their rolls.  About right?  Fascinate:  I don't have to go to fantasy to understand this one.  Just try interrupting someone who is engrossed in listening to music.  If you survive the response, you'll understand fascinate.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />  Interesting ability.  Bard sees 4 orcs, starts playing.  Orcs sit down and listen.  Or, bard sees barroom brawl imminent.  Bard fascinates would-be instigator of brawl.  Brawl is averted.  Again ... bard rolls 1d20.  Rolls 10.  Add 3 for 17 Charisma.  Add 4 for Perform 4.  17.  That is the Will Save orcs or would-be brawler have to make to escape Fascinate effect.  About right?  Inspire Courage:  If 3.5 allowed stacking of like bonus types, there'd be no point in this.  It gives a Morale bonus to BAB and to damage.  It gives a + 1 to BSB (Base Save Bonus) against fear and charm.  Inspire Competence:  Prior to tonight, I had never heard of a Competence Bonus.  Now I see there is one.  This one is + 2, but it affects only skills (not a small thing ...)  Suggestion:  I read that a wizard's spell DC (Difficulty Class) is 10 plus the wizard's intelligence bonus + the spell level.  Here, the bonus is 10 plus the charisma modifier plus 1/2  the bard's level.  I don't know how powerful Suggestion is in 3.5.  Will have to read the spell.  I just considered something.  It's sorta humorous, I think.  Powerful creatures like drow and illithid make it a point to learn Common.  That's a mistake, since it makes them subject to this attack.  Inspire Greatness:  There's that Competence Bonus again:  + 2 to Attack Rolls, + 1 to Fortitude Saves, gain 2d10 hit dice (does this mean the character is 2 levels higher for all purposes?  A wizard would gain 2 levels and new spells briefly?  Monks would gain the benefits of being 2 levels higher with new special abilities?) and appropriate hit points plus constitution bonus (does this mean that, when the creature loses those bonus hit points, it instantly dies?  That is, it only had 3 hit points left and when the temporary hit points went away, it dropped to - 15?)  Song of Freedom:  I will have to read Break Enchantment.  Inspire Heroics:  + 4 Morale Bonus to all saves, + 4 dodge bonus to AC.  Mass Suggestion:  Will have to read the Suggestion spell.  If several bards of differing levels are present, and each uses one of the powers above, do the effects stack?  For example, if one bard is using Inspire Courage, another Inspire Greatness, and yet another Inspire Heroics on my character, wouldn't he get:  + 2 Morale Bonus for saves against fear and charm (8th level bard)  + 2 Morale Bonus on Attack Rolls and Damage Rolls (8th level bard)  stacked with ...  2 extra levels (additional abilities?)  2d10 hit points plus constitution bonus for 2 levels.  + 2 Competence Bonus on Attack Rolls.  + 1 Competence Bonus on Fortitude Saves.  stacked with ...  + 4 Morale Bonus on all Saving Throws.  + 4 Dodge Bonus to Armor Class.  Which would mean my character would get ...  + 2 Morale Bonus for saves against fear and charm (8th level bard)  + 2 Morale Bonus on Attack Rolls and Damage Rolls (8th level bard)  2 extra levels (additional abilities?)  2d10 hit points plus constitution bonus for 2 levels.  + 2 Competence Bonus on Attack Rolls.  + 1 Competence Bonus on Fortitude Saves.  + 4 Morale Bonus on all Saving Throws.  + 4 Dodge Bonus to Armor Class.  But, because the same types of bonuses don't stack, it would be ...  + 4 Morale Bonus on all Saving Throws (but not + 6 versus Fear and Charm, because that is also a Morale Bonus, which wouldn't stack with the + 4 Morale Bonus)  + 1 Competence Bonus on Fortitude Saves (total + 5 bonus to Fortitude Saves)  + 2 Morale Bonus on Attack Rolls and Damage Rolls  + 2 Competence Bonus on Attack Rolls (total of + 4 to Attack Rolls, since Morale and Competence stack)  + 4 Dodge Bonus to Armor Class.  2 extra levels (additional abilities?) plus 2d10 hit points plus Constitution Hit Point bonus for 2 levels.    Is this correct?</blockquote>

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