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<blockquote data-quote="Edena_of_Neith" data-source="post: 2795099" data-attributes="member: 2020">You are thinking of a 3rd edition 20th level fighter.&nbsp; I'm talking about a 2nd edition 20th level fighter.&nbsp; Converting his 2nd edition stats into 3rd edition terminology, he has BAB +20, Fort/Ref/Will saves of roughly +15 to +17, and he can attack twice per round (4 times per round if he uses a weapon in his off-hand.)&nbsp; If he has +5 plate armor, a +5 shield, and 18 dexterity, he has a 2E dexterity of -12, which in 3rd edition would be thought of as a 32.&nbsp; But he does not have access to deflection bonuses (what is a deflection bonus?)&nbsp; He has no access to insight bonuses, dodge bonuses, or any other types of bonuses!&nbsp; Because those didn't exist in 2E, he can't use them now.&nbsp; He's stuck with his mighty +5 plate armor and +5 shield.&nbsp; (He was quite content with those, in 2E!)&nbsp; Now ...&nbsp; The fighter has a magic weapon.&nbsp; In 2E, that meant if he hit, he hit.&nbsp; Now, it means that even if he hit, he has a 50/50 chance of missing.&nbsp; (There was no such thing as a ghost touch weapon in 2E.)&nbsp; Nor could he stack any additional bonuses onto his +5 armor.&nbsp; +5 armor, was +5 armor.&nbsp; That was it!&nbsp; Nothing more!&nbsp; +5 ghost touch full plate was an unheard of dream back in 2nd edition.&nbsp; Remember that in 3rd edition characters (and monsters) have infinitely more choices than they had before.&nbsp; But the fighter, brought forward in time, is still stuck with the 2nd edition rules, while his opponent - the wraith - gets to use the full 3rd edition ruleset!&nbsp; So, the wraith starts attacking the AC 13 (AC 7, 2nd edition, since the fighter is stuck with his 2nd edition rules) fighter.&nbsp; Those levels start coming off real, real quick.&nbsp; (Give the wraith high levels in a class and multiple attacks, and the fighter just shrivels like burned toast in a broken toaster.)&nbsp; Methinks the fighter wouldn't wait around to find out how the new ruleset was going to affect him, when he was stuck with the old ruleset.&nbsp; Methinks the fighter, after realizing he was Armor Class 7 (2nd edition) would ... as I said ... pull the Olympic World Record for the 50 yard dash.&nbsp; 3rd edition characters and monsters can pull stunts beyond the wildest dreams of 2nd and 1st edition characters.&nbsp; And I read that there exists a feat, by the way, that allows an epic wizard to take an extra quickened spell each round, when this epic feat is taken.&nbsp; Furthermore, the feat stacks:&nbsp; every time it is taken, the mage can unload another quicken spell in a round.&nbsp; So, take the epic feat 5 times, unload 6 quickened spells in a single round.&nbsp; And then the epic mage still gets his standard and move actions for the round, as well.&nbsp; <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile&nbsp; &nbsp; :)"&nbsp; data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />&nbsp; (looks at the cost and experience point cost of the Girdle of Giant Strength)&nbsp; Building a Girdle would be too expensive and costly in experience to do in the current time.&nbsp; Back in the Arcane Age, I am guessing, the rules for creating epic spells and epic items must have been different (read:&nbsp; easier.)&nbsp; That's when they made the girdles.&nbsp; And some of them are still around today.&nbsp; My take.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Edena_of_Neith, post: 2795099, member: 2020"] You are thinking of a 3rd edition 20th level fighter. I'm talking about a 2nd edition 20th level fighter. Converting his 2nd edition stats into 3rd edition terminology, he has BAB +20, Fort/Ref/Will saves of roughly +15 to +17, and he can attack twice per round (4 times per round if he uses a weapon in his off-hand.) If he has +5 plate armor, a +5 shield, and 18 dexterity, he has a 2E dexterity of -12, which in 3rd edition would be thought of as a 32. But he does not have access to deflection bonuses (what is a deflection bonus?) He has no access to insight bonuses, dodge bonuses, or any other types of bonuses! Because those didn't exist in 2E, he can't use them now. He's stuck with his mighty +5 plate armor and +5 shield. (He was quite content with those, in 2E!) Now ... The fighter has a magic weapon. In 2E, that meant if he hit, he hit. Now, it means that even if he hit, he has a 50/50 chance of missing. (There was no such thing as a ghost touch weapon in 2E.) Nor could he stack any additional bonuses onto his +5 armor. +5 armor, was +5 armor. That was it! Nothing more! +5 ghost touch full plate was an unheard of dream back in 2nd edition. Remember that in 3rd edition characters (and monsters) have infinitely more choices than they had before. But the fighter, brought forward in time, is still stuck with the 2nd edition rules, while his opponent - the wraith - gets to use the full 3rd edition ruleset! So, the wraith starts attacking the AC 13 (AC 7, 2nd edition, since the fighter is stuck with his 2nd edition rules) fighter. Those levels start coming off real, real quick. (Give the wraith high levels in a class and multiple attacks, and the fighter just shrivels like burned toast in a broken toaster.) Methinks the fighter wouldn't wait around to find out how the new ruleset was going to affect him, when he was stuck with the old ruleset. Methinks the fighter, after realizing he was Armor Class 7 (2nd edition) would ... as I said ... pull the Olympic World Record for the 50 yard dash. 3rd edition characters and monsters can pull stunts beyond the wildest dreams of 2nd and 1st edition characters. And I read that there exists a feat, by the way, that allows an epic wizard to take an extra quickened spell each round, when this epic feat is taken. Furthermore, the feat stacks: every time it is taken, the mage can unload another quicken spell in a round. So, take the epic feat 5 times, unload 6 quickened spells in a single round. And then the epic mage still gets his standard and move actions for the round, as well. :) (looks at the cost and experience point cost of the Girdle of Giant Strength) Building a Girdle would be too expensive and costly in experience to do in the current time. Back in the Arcane Age, I am guessing, the rules for creating epic spells and epic items must have been different (read: easier.) That's when they made the girdles. And some of them are still around today. My take. [/QUOTE]

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