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*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Complete Disagreement With Mike on Monsters (see post #205)
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<blockquote data-quote="Majoru Oakheart" data-source="post: 3765502" data-attributes="member: 5143"><p>No, I'm saying that all that information is in the stat block and it's never been suggested that we lose any of it. Charming an enemy doesn't require knowing more about it than using it as an enemy. Neither does any of the other options.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Remember when the designers said that the system is very interconnected? Who says that in 4e disarm isn't an opposed strength check meaning that we now have the information? Assuming dispelling won't change this monster at all, no information needs to be in the stat block. Maybe your AC doesn't change when flatfooted so more information is not needed. Maybe there is a general rule that states that all creatures do 1d3 damage with their unarmed strikes and that they have the same plus to hit with their unarmed strikes as their normal attacks.</p><p></p><p>Plus, my example was just an example...I probably missed some information in there, but not much.</p><p></p><p>The only thing I've heard from the designers are:</p><p>-Stat blocks have been shortened through an ingenious method, you'll have to see it</p><p>-Monsters still have all the stats they did before(they still have feats, saves, skills, etc)</p><p>-Monsters have roles in the same way that classes have roles</p><p></p><p></p><p>I never suggested this options would be removed. I think all the same options would be available as before. The options themselves will be simpler and therefore require less information.</p><p></p><p></p><p>What? Why won't it be as simple as reading the combat stats off a table?</p><p></p><p>If a creature has an ability that says:</p><p>Fire Breath (Ex): 60 ft Cone of Fire, 10d6, +10 to hit</p><p>or</p><p>Teleport (Su): 1/encounter put the creature in any square within 100ft that it can see</p><p></p><p>Those seem simple to me. I don't need to read any other sections of the book to understand them. It doesn't require any prep time (since the monster is already written in the Monster Manual and I'm just reading it as I'm running the creature).</p><p></p><p>As it is now, creatures are listed as having spell like abilities, which have to take standard actions, since that's the general rule(you have to make up a special ability if you want to be able to use a spell as a swift action, for instance). They refer to spells in the PHB, which you have to look up if you don't know what they do. Then you need to read the half page long description of the spell to figure out what it does.</p><p></p><p>I see it as removing 10 layers of complexity and then adding 1 back. Does it mean that monsters now can just have abilities that you'd never give to players in a million years? Yup. Does it mean that you likely won't be able to create a 10th level Goblin without a LOT of pre-session work? Yep, I think so. It will make us more reliant on Monster Manuals for creatures instead of making them up ourselves, and increase the number of very similar monsters we have. In exchange, the actual running of the monsters will be a lot easier since you won't be trying to remember 20 general rules about monsters, instead just using the stats as written.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Majoru Oakheart, post: 3765502, member: 5143"] No, I'm saying that all that information is in the stat block and it's never been suggested that we lose any of it. Charming an enemy doesn't require knowing more about it than using it as an enemy. Neither does any of the other options. Remember when the designers said that the system is very interconnected? Who says that in 4e disarm isn't an opposed strength check meaning that we now have the information? Assuming dispelling won't change this monster at all, no information needs to be in the stat block. Maybe your AC doesn't change when flatfooted so more information is not needed. Maybe there is a general rule that states that all creatures do 1d3 damage with their unarmed strikes and that they have the same plus to hit with their unarmed strikes as their normal attacks. Plus, my example was just an example...I probably missed some information in there, but not much. The only thing I've heard from the designers are: -Stat blocks have been shortened through an ingenious method, you'll have to see it -Monsters still have all the stats they did before(they still have feats, saves, skills, etc) -Monsters have roles in the same way that classes have roles I never suggested this options would be removed. I think all the same options would be available as before. The options themselves will be simpler and therefore require less information. What? Why won't it be as simple as reading the combat stats off a table? If a creature has an ability that says: Fire Breath (Ex): 60 ft Cone of Fire, 10d6, +10 to hit or Teleport (Su): 1/encounter put the creature in any square within 100ft that it can see Those seem simple to me. I don't need to read any other sections of the book to understand them. It doesn't require any prep time (since the monster is already written in the Monster Manual and I'm just reading it as I'm running the creature). As it is now, creatures are listed as having spell like abilities, which have to take standard actions, since that's the general rule(you have to make up a special ability if you want to be able to use a spell as a swift action, for instance). They refer to spells in the PHB, which you have to look up if you don't know what they do. Then you need to read the half page long description of the spell to figure out what it does. I see it as removing 10 layers of complexity and then adding 1 back. Does it mean that monsters now can just have abilities that you'd never give to players in a million years? Yup. Does it mean that you likely won't be able to create a 10th level Goblin without a LOT of pre-session work? Yep, I think so. It will make us more reliant on Monster Manuals for creatures instead of making them up ourselves, and increase the number of very similar monsters we have. In exchange, the actual running of the monsters will be a lot easier since you won't be trying to remember 20 general rules about monsters, instead just using the stats as written. [/QUOTE]
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