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<blockquote data-quote="Nonei" data-source="post: 5582364" data-attributes="member: 88176">The Vancian style of magic always irked me as well, Personally I would prefer a system that the easiest spells are unlimited but the harder spells cost some sort of 'points' in the sense that this is how much effort it takes to cast.&nbsp; Many fantasy books have epic conflicts with the wizards drained or almost dead from that last desperate spellcasting - so some sort of fatigue system would work well. This is how True20 did it; I haven't actually played a game of it but I am intrigued by parts of the magic system.&nbsp; Basically, it is treated as skill checks, including the ability to take 10 on most spells, and 20 if no risk of failure. The magic user can increase the ability like a skill...&nbsp; Many spells are non-fatiguing, i.e. simple, and so have no difficulty, but the more difficult spells and supernatural abilities (it lumps them into one) are assigned a DC&nbsp; - or a range of difficulties so you can use, say, create fire to do a flame or a fireball simply by upping the DC.&nbsp; If a magic user fails to make the DC, they are fatigued.&nbsp; Multiple uses of 'fatiguing' spells in a short time (without an hour of avoiding the fatiguing spells in between) increases the DC to avoid the fatigue by 1 each time.Rather than the SRD rules for fatigue, they have 3 levels&nbsp; -winded (-1 str or dex, cannot run or charge) -fatigued (same as srd), and exhausted (same as SRD), (then unconscious) and after an hour of rest, the player can make a fort save to recover 1 level of fatigue. ..&nbsp; they really tried to avoid the 4 minute workday in True20.&nbsp; There are a lot of other differences in other areas too, the manual is actually a pretty interesting read.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Nonei, post: 5582364, member: 88176"] The Vancian style of magic always irked me as well, Personally I would prefer a system that the easiest spells are unlimited but the harder spells cost some sort of 'points' in the sense that this is how much effort it takes to cast. Many fantasy books have epic conflicts with the wizards drained or almost dead from that last desperate spellcasting - so some sort of fatigue system would work well. This is how True20 did it; I haven't actually played a game of it but I am intrigued by parts of the magic system. Basically, it is treated as skill checks, including the ability to take 10 on most spells, and 20 if no risk of failure. The magic user can increase the ability like a skill... Many spells are non-fatiguing, i.e. simple, and so have no difficulty, but the more difficult spells and supernatural abilities (it lumps them into one) are assigned a DC - or a range of difficulties so you can use, say, create fire to do a flame or a fireball simply by upping the DC. If a magic user fails to make the DC, they are fatigued. Multiple uses of 'fatiguing' spells in a short time (without an hour of avoiding the fatiguing spells in between) increases the DC to avoid the fatigue by 1 each time. Rather than the SRD rules for fatigue, they have 3 levels -winded (-1 str or dex, cannot run or charge) -fatigued (same as srd), and exhausted (same as SRD), (then unconscious) and after an hour of rest, the player can make a fort save to recover 1 level of fatigue. .. they really tried to avoid the 4 minute workday in True20. There are a lot of other differences in other areas too, the manual is actually a pretty interesting read. [/QUOTE]

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