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<blockquote data-quote="Imaro" data-source="post: 5956785" data-attributes="member: 48965">And again, I think both examples aren't representative of what really goes on at a game... and that was my point anything can be boiled down to a simplistic (and absurd) representation. &nbsp;&nbsp;Why do you have a good guess on who is and isn't a minion? And I'm going to go with this being a terrible tactic unless your DM is identifying exactly what monsters are and aren't minions.&nbsp;&nbsp;And yet with limited resources (encounters and dailies) don't you want to identify the most powerful threats (to minimize the damage your party takes from them) to control with these types of powers?&nbsp;&nbsp;I agree... but is it wise to drop your daily or encounter if you don't know whether it's all minions, a minion/regulart mix or all regular monsters... that was my question, not whether AoE is a good opener or not.&nbsp;&nbsp;Yep, and you don't want to use your daily in the first round of the first fight with the big bads minion group of nobodies... also, using a power early is not the same as saying you should open with it.&nbsp;&nbsp;But again, we are talking about the powers a party opens with, not interrupts which are triggered by other actions.&nbsp;&nbsp;Again unless there is a specific reason to use a daily to accomplish this push in the first round of combat... why wouldn't you use an at-will since pushing/pulling/sliding the monsters is the primary goal... and you still want to use a more damaging power ina situation where the damage actually counts... not on a group of minions.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Imaro, post: 5956785, member: 48965"] And again, I think both examples aren't representative of what really goes on at a game... and that was my point anything can be boiled down to a simplistic (and absurd) representation. Why do you have a good guess on who is and isn't a minion? And I'm going to go with this being a terrible tactic unless your DM is identifying exactly what monsters are and aren't minions. And yet with limited resources (encounters and dailies) don't you want to identify the most powerful threats (to minimize the damage your party takes from them) to control with these types of powers? I agree... but is it wise to drop your daily or encounter if you don't know whether it's all minions, a minion/regulart mix or all regular monsters... that was my question, not whether AoE is a good opener or not. Yep, and you don't want to use your daily in the first round of the first fight with the big bads minion group of nobodies... also, using a power early is not the same as saying you should open with it. But again, we are talking about the powers a party opens with, not interrupts which are triggered by other actions. Again unless there is a specific reason to use a daily to accomplish this push in the first round of combat... why wouldn't you use an at-will since pushing/pulling/sliding the monsters is the primary goal... and you still want to use a more damaging power ina situation where the damage actually counts... not on a group of minions. [/QUOTE]

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