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<blockquote data-quote="Dromdol" data-source="post: 3662120" data-attributes="member: 53831">Or maybe both RPGs and MMORPGs are reality simulators? Aren't both attempting to allow you to project yourself into a fantastic world with interactivity?Did you read my post above? I don't know your experience in an MMO, I can't comment on that, but I know my own experience. I've interacted with dozens, even hundreds, of fellow players to achieve goals. I've run afoul of powerful alliances that were capable of reacting to me in a very real fashion. Hardcore PvP isn't for everyone, but deriding MMOs as two-dimensional and repetitive grinds is dismissing a huge portion of the player base that participates in PvP activities - activities with actors and audiences, with real consequences, and with as much emotional reality and depth as the very real players on the other side of those avatars.So when I'm on vent doing a castle siege with fifty or sixty guildmates, coordinating and captaining divisions of players into their roles, receiving and transitting orders, living, dying, fighting, and thinking on an imagined battlefield with friends, enemies, passing acquaintances, allies, and traitors alike, I'm not having fun with my friends, I'm not seeing a good story, and I'm not developing a memorable experience? I beg to differ.I've been in tabletop games that were little more than hack'n'slash fests with no depth. How many old 1st ed. modules were little more than a series of traps and beasties with a bare semblance of a plot, excusing rampaging dungeoneering and not much else? I know those were some of my first experiences with roleplaying thirty years ago. If they were &quot;roleplaying&quot; then how is an MMO any different? Some of those were immensely fun, for certain, but they had no more (if as much) depth as a good MMORPG.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Dromdol, post: 3662120, member: 53831"] Or maybe both RPGs and MMORPGs are reality simulators? Aren't both attempting to allow you to project yourself into a fantastic world with interactivity? Did you read my post above? I don't know your experience in an MMO, I can't comment on that, but I know my own experience. I've interacted with dozens, even hundreds, of fellow players to achieve goals. I've run afoul of powerful alliances that were capable of reacting to me in a very real fashion. Hardcore PvP isn't for everyone, but deriding MMOs as two-dimensional and repetitive grinds is dismissing a huge portion of the player base that participates in PvP activities - activities with actors and audiences, with real consequences, and with as much emotional reality and depth as the very real players on the other side of those avatars. So when I'm on vent doing a castle siege with fifty or sixty guildmates, coordinating and captaining divisions of players into their roles, receiving and transitting orders, living, dying, fighting, and thinking on an imagined battlefield with friends, enemies, passing acquaintances, allies, and traitors alike, I'm not having fun with my friends, I'm not seeing a good story, and I'm not developing a memorable experience? I beg to differ. I've been in tabletop games that were little more than hack'n'slash fests with no depth. How many old 1st ed. modules were little more than a series of traps and beasties with a bare semblance of a plot, excusing rampaging dungeoneering and not much else? I know those were some of my first experiences with roleplaying thirty years ago. If they were "roleplaying" then how is an MMO any different? Some of those were immensely fun, for certain, but they had no more (if as much) depth as a good MMORPG. [/QUOTE]

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