Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Contrivance in story dynamics
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 8835651" data-attributes="member: 82106"><p>I feel a bit unhappy with your use of the 'immersionist' in this context, as it would tend to indicate that there is LESS immersion in character in a game that is more 'authorial' to use your term. I mean, the argument gets made that 'meta-game processes' break immersion. Its one of those kinds of statements that cannot really be examined, its purely subjective. I just maintain that my identification with my character is no more difficult because of that than because of all the fairly contrived stuff that goes into "you are a party" or whatever. [USER=42582]@pemerton[/USER] has also pretty consistently argued that there are other deal-breaking aspects, like the way in which the character's understanding of the world has to be fed to him, where it would be inherent in reality, and that the authorial activity, in his opinion (which I tend to agree with), better matches with a verisimilitudinous experience of being the character.</p><p></p><p>I don't know, I suppose there are factors which account for these preferences, though they may be so personal and non-specific as to be beyond analysis in any realistic sense.</p><p></p><p>I think, though, it is a legitimate criticism of TB (at least TB2, which is all I've played) that the process of play is VERY all-encompassing and thus you find yourself heavily 'in the meta'. Where with a game like Dungeon World as a player I often find myself focusing almost entirely on the fiction, that is hard to achieve in TB2. The difference being DW is much less structured above the 'participants make moves' level. Probably the main thing that happens on the player side above that level is the GM may ask the players, out of character, questions, and then use the answers. Actually I don't think DW intends those questions to BE out of character, they are addressed to the characters, not the players. However, they are likely to provoke 'player side' thinking as "Do you think there's an ocean to the east?" COULD be asked of a character, but they would never think "well, should I say 'yes' and signal that I want to go sailing or 'no there's a desert' and signal something else?"</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="AbdulAlhazred, post: 8835651, member: 82106"] I feel a bit unhappy with your use of the 'immersionist' in this context, as it would tend to indicate that there is LESS immersion in character in a game that is more 'authorial' to use your term. I mean, the argument gets made that 'meta-game processes' break immersion. Its one of those kinds of statements that cannot really be examined, its purely subjective. I just maintain that my identification with my character is no more difficult because of that than because of all the fairly contrived stuff that goes into "you are a party" or whatever. [USER=42582]@pemerton[/USER] has also pretty consistently argued that there are other deal-breaking aspects, like the way in which the character's understanding of the world has to be fed to him, where it would be inherent in reality, and that the authorial activity, in his opinion (which I tend to agree with), better matches with a verisimilitudinous experience of being the character. I don't know, I suppose there are factors which account for these preferences, though they may be so personal and non-specific as to be beyond analysis in any realistic sense. I think, though, it is a legitimate criticism of TB (at least TB2, which is all I've played) that the process of play is VERY all-encompassing and thus you find yourself heavily 'in the meta'. Where with a game like Dungeon World as a player I often find myself focusing almost entirely on the fiction, that is hard to achieve in TB2. The difference being DW is much less structured above the 'participants make moves' level. Probably the main thing that happens on the player side above that level is the GM may ask the players, out of character, questions, and then use the answers. Actually I don't think DW intends those questions to BE out of character, they are addressed to the characters, not the players. However, they are likely to provoke 'player side' thinking as "Do you think there's an ocean to the east?" COULD be asked of a character, but they would never think "well, should I say 'yes' and signal that I want to go sailing or 'no there's a desert' and signal something else?" [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Contrivance in story dynamics
Top