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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Goonalan" data-source="post: 5438726" data-attributes="member: 16069">After 30 years of DMing D&D all editions and many of the games you listed I find myself content to play 4e. Although the 4e I play is not the game that you describe- in fact, your description is a little odd, you seem to have settled upon defining the game by the rules.In previous paragraphs you describe a number of other games, and again come to the conclusion, at times, that the rules are broken.The last session of D&D I played (4 hours long), involved no combat, a singing competition, a githyanki being chatted up by a Tiefling, some gambling, and half-a-dozen encounters that involved players doing things that involved the rules slightly [make an x check] and then me the DM (me) adjudicating the results, but as reliant on the PCs RP skills as the dice roll. The only skill challenge involved each PC humming (or la-la-la-ing) a tune for the other players to guess at- 4 successes before 3 failures (this was the singing competition)- no dice were used at all.Next week there'll be a fight or two, also one of the PCs will be delivering a 200 word sermon at the House of the Sun (Temple of Pelor)- the sermon needs to include quotes from famous Pelorian saints and will be written and not ad-libed. Another PC will be further romancing a female Tiefling (diner at the Silver Unicorn Inn)- a Skill CHallenge of sorts for which the player is preparing a comprehensive list of his most effective chat up lines- ever, he has promised he will 'get into my pants'.The week previously there were two combat encounters, one a big fight with lots of Undead that was pretty nasty, the other with three PCs versus 21 Giant Rats, with the rats appearing 1- then 2- then 3- then 4- then 5- then 6 (round by round), with each PC not being able to move out of their section of the room- all Rats were Minions and the entire thing was played as a mini game- Splat the Rat! The fight was a chance for Rogar (Halfling Monk, and ex-Ratcatcher) to prove to Bith the Ratter (NPC Ratcatcher) that he still had the old magic. It took fifteen minutes to play out.I keep reading threads here that descibe D&Dx as being- insert rules, in many respects the game I play (called D&D) has changed very little in the last 30 years, it's as broad as our colective imaginations and governed by my judicious touch (the mailed fist within the silk glove).There are rules of course, and I've read a few of them, but the last rules book I read all the way through was... damn, I don't even think I read the first edition books.In previous installments PCs have undertaken drinking competitions (with physical activities thrown in, which the players (not the PCs) have to do), romanced Princesses, taken part in detective like scenarios, discovered that they were actually a prototype automaton (a Dwarforged), slept with an Aboleth, arm-wrestled Ogres, danced with Fey, gambled with a Frog, surfed on lava, romanced a ghost, escaped a sea on poisonous blood by leaping from on top of a demon's head and then leaping to the next, and the next...Dice were involved, sometimes, I get that this version has a lot of stuff about combat, if fights are not what you want then don't do them, or at least change the rules to suit your needs. 4E, IMHO, has been the easiest iteration to bend to suit my needs, and the easiest to improv on the fly.You should see the stuff I have got lined up for my PCs... Just madness.As to wether you should try 4e another again- meh, as Yoda said-"Do, or do not. There is no try."Good luck with whatever you go for.Oh and like you I found my players here at ENWorld, they've been with me for three years now, and are dotted all over the globe, I've had four players leave in that time- all due to time/work, four of my players have been with me since the beginning. Three of the players that have had to leave have stayed in touch, still read our adventures and e-mail me still asking questions, commenting and trying to find ways to get back in the game (at times). Only I, and one other player, had played 4e previously when we started.</blockquote>

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