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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Derro" data-source="post: 4378407" data-attributes="member: 51010">Gaaah. <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/erm.png"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":erm:" title="Erm    :erm:" data-shortname=":erm:" />I will admit my ignorance here. I forgot most of that stuff was in 3.5. Since those things appeared in Masters of the Wild I mis-remembered them as splat stuff.For the most part you are correct because of my above oversight.That's a pretty mighty druid. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f631.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":eek:" title="Eek!    :eek:"  data-smilie="9"data-shortname=":eek:" />There's a few things in there that I can't get behind (quickening cure critical? take the round to cast heal, I say, and shapechanging into a planetar is a party trick at 20th level <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> ) but truly it's that Natural Spell that does me in.A fighter of equivalent level has got a better AC, HP, and attack/damage potential even when the druid is buffed. It would be a fight weighted toward the fighter if it was just druid and animal companion against lone fighter. With a dancing weapon and a greatsword of speed the animal companion is minced in 2 rounds while the dancer engages the druid.But, again I admit my bad, it's all moot due to Natural spell. That is the major kicker, the druid can assume combat form and still bust out heals, debuffs, and continued buffs as needed.I won't bother with a fighter build. There's plenty a fighter can do to bring the pain but short of rings of spell turning and EPIC armors of spell resistance there's little a fighter can do against targeted save-or-suck spells.So I'll concede that point, gladly.Regarding actions against buffed-out druid (i.e. dispels, greater dispels, combat actions, etc.) I'll just clarify that I wasn't specifically referring to fighter vs. druid but rather anybody vs. druid. The original comment I was replying to stated that the Druid 20 controlled all. That's crap. Spell-caster 20 of any class can take on just about anything else within a reasonable challenge range. The invisible, flying, summoning wizard with the CL 10 wand of whatever is a pretty good contender against most anything.  I get it that the Cleric and Druid have a lot of advantages but the biggest downside to their schtick is that they need the time to buff. Get the jump on them and most of the time they are screwed. With arcanists not so much. They've generally got a bag of tricks that allows for a quick escape and counter-strike. Which is sort of the problem with our contrived scenarios. It tends to assume the optimum condition for whatever argument is being made. Not to say that those conditions never exist but they are hardly the standard in most cases.</blockquote>

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