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<blockquote data-quote="Trainz" data-source="post: 2051041" data-attributes="member: 2122">Magic item inflation at epic levels. Back in 1st Ed, you could play 40 or so level characters, but didn't need +20 items to &quot;stay in the game&quot;. The magic items in the DMG were quite sufficient, it just meant you probably had all the +5 versions of them. And you Kicked Major Arse. You could walk up to Tiamat and make her quiver with fear, only wearing full plate +5, shield +5, and vorpal sword +5. She was scared man. Of course, at very high levels, you probably had an artefact or two in the party, but they meant something.Motherload of bonuses/penalties.I'm starting to loathe very much the exercise in accounting that combat entails. I'm currently running a 9th level campaign, and in the last fight the following spells were cast: recitation, prayer, haste, and the enemy was raging. Add to this that half the party was using Combat Expertise and Power Attack, and every die roll was preceded by a &quot;waitaminute&quot; by the player. This is not what I have in mind when I'm thinking about having fun gaming.I'm all for bonuses, but when most of them are permanent, like stat boosting items, or magic items. They are all computed and added on the character sheet, all totaled. I don't care if a spell or two temporarily gives bonuses, but when half of them does, it's insane.Spell damage caps.Back in 1st Ed, I saw wizards throw 40 dice fireballs, 20 dice magic missiles. It didn't screw up anything. Now they nerfed this (since 2nd ed), but forced casters to invest in metamagic feats and magic items to recover those 40 dice spells. 10 times the complexity, for the same net result. That's not an evolution, that's a step back.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Trainz, post: 2051041, member: 2122"] Magic item inflation at epic levels. Back in 1st Ed, you could play 40 or so level characters, but didn't need +20 items to "stay in the game". The magic items in the DMG were quite sufficient, it just meant you probably had all the +5 versions of them. And you Kicked Major Arse. You could walk up to Tiamat and make her quiver with fear, only wearing full plate +5, shield +5, and vorpal sword +5. She was [i]scared[/i] man. Of course, at very high levels, you probably had an artefact or two in the party, but they [i]meant[/i] something. Motherload of bonuses/penalties. I'm starting to loathe very much the exercise in accounting that combat entails. I'm currently running a 9th level campaign, and in the last fight the following spells were cast: [i]recitation, prayer, haste[/i], and the enemy was raging. Add to this that half the party was using [i]Combat Expertise[/i] and [i]Power Attack[/i], and every die roll was preceded by a "waitaminute" by the player. This is not what I have in mind when I'm thinking about having fun gaming. I'm all for bonuses, but when most of them are permanent, like stat boosting items, or magic items. They are all computed and added on the character sheet, all totaled. I don't care if a spell or two temporarily gives bonuses, but when half of them does, it's insane. Spell damage caps. Back in 1st Ed, I saw wizards throw 40 dice fireballs, 20 dice magic missiles. It didn't screw up anything. Now they nerfed this (since 2nd ed), but forced casters to invest in metamagic feats and magic items to recover those 40 dice spells. 10 times the complexity, for the same net result. That's not an evolution, that's a step back. [/QUOTE]

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