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Message: <blockquote data-quote="xenoflare" data-source="post: 1467903" data-attributes="member: 12431">Hi, sorry for rambling...Just paraphrasing a point from some of my research on demonology in Hinduism; Dr Gail Sutherland has pointed out that the cosmology of the Mahabharata epic in Hinduism involves an overwhelming focus on law vs. chaos. This cosmology displaces the responsibility for the control of ashuras (as demonic forces of chaos) from the realm of the devas (as celestial forces of law) to the realm of man. While the ashuras and devas may war in their planes, it is the role of human society to regulate chaos.. Order must be upheld in this cosmic relationship usually through the role of mortals (or in our gaming case, the Prime).Yudhistira, the most righteous of the Pandava brothers (i think he'll be some Epic Half-celestial Seer) addresses a demon who seeks to eat some children along with him with this rebuke in the Mahabharata:"Your righteousness is disintegrating, fool, and you don't see it. The humans, the animals, the Gandharvas (avorals in DnD), the Raksasas, the birds and the cattle all live off men, and so do you. Your world prospers by the prosperity of ours. The deities grieve along with the grieving world but they flourish when worshipped with oblations and ancestor offerings. We are the herdsmen and protectors of the kingdom, raksasa. If the kingdom is unprotected, how can there be good fortune, how can there be happiness? A Raksasa must never be disrespectful toward a sinless king and we have never committed the slightest offence, man-eater."cosmic laws have to be followed in this cosmology, which the raksasa refuses to follow - and in so doing, he renounces his dharma as a demon, and his demonic powers forsake him, and he loses his prowess and is slain.but there are also other cases of deviation and subversion- where a demon becomes an ascetic, virtuous of manner and conduct, pure of thought and heart, and is rebuked by his own father for being a traitor and false demon, is warned by priests for being subversive against the natural order. This kindly demon converts an entire kingdom of ogres and demons to the worship of Lord Shiva, and the cosmos rejects them, and the sun burns them all... in so doing, these demons are destroyed for their piety. (some say the priests fear for their own loss of relevance in a world where demons are virtuous... the chaotic evil demons, by being chaotic against chaos, become lawful good, and the boundaries of good and evil, law and chaos are broken - the system cannot allow these "others", so useful for internal harmony, to become internalized, and thus destroys them.)but they are also emancipated from their brooding forms, and transcend their demonic aspect. they become gods, they become deities that protect the people they used to eat.. and they become worshipped as bringers of rain, slayers of disease-spirits. in that sense, their adherence to the doctrine of rebelling agains "chaos" - a chaotic act, or is it a lawful one? - allowed them to transcend the limitations of illusionary reality, and to comprehend truth.This of course presupposes a series of cosmic laws in your campaign that already exist.. but nothing is fixed. Through adherences to these laws, the dissonance between chaos and law is shattered.. this philosophy is very much summed up in Hinduism (following dharmas of caste and life-path), Islam (being obedient to the will of God), and Buddhism (law of cause and effect). Demons are usually those who refuse to follow the law.. and in so doing, gain power from the system as "others", as "outsiders", deviant beings who disobey reality and have to be beaten up by heroes haha..so.. i guess to bring it back to your campaign.. is truth law, or is truth chaos? can fiends become celestials, is permanence dominant, or is reality protean and shifting? there exists a fine balance, i suppose, between the truths of eternal law - something is something, but at the same time, something can become something else. law.. and chaos.. both exist in tandem with each other.</blockquote>

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