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Countering Rest Spells (Tiny Hut, Rope Trick, et al)
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<blockquote data-quote="Oofta" data-source="post: 7883146" data-attributes="member: 6801845"><p>Not really a lot new here to respond to.</p><p></p><p><strong>Dragons</strong></p><p>I brought up a dragon because it was mentioned in another thread that a dracolich (who didn't have dispel magic apparently) could do nothing while the party got a long rest. I pointed out the various things they could do, all of which were declared to be "pointless" for one reason or another with no supporting justification. Well, other than "I said it wouldn't work so therefore I've already shown you that it wouldn't work."</p><p></p><p>So I gave details on how I would run a black dragon. Darkness so the party couldn't see and then bury the hut in whatever's handy. The response, of course is that's ridiculous and that the party would just counter it somehow. Again, no details or options given*. IMHO they have the option of leaving the hut before they get a long rest which is what the dragon wants or they're going to be buried under tons of crud. The only counter was that "they'll figure something out because they're smart like me".</p><p></p><p>The hut is also supposedly a great spot to prep, and under certain circumstances it might be. But usually prep only takes a few actions, the hut takes 11 minutes. Not really seeing the benefit.</p><p></p><p>Oh, and grabbing the NPC wizard was a joke, although I still think in many cases dragons will have allies or other resources that could be brought to bear.</p><p></p><p><strong>The Home Depot</strong></p><p>This one kind of cracks me up to be honest. In my campaign I had a couple dozen hobgoblins build a temporary, makeshift wall so that they could approach the hut without being targeted by ranged attacks. This temporary wall was somehow transformed into an impenatrable engineering marvel that would require the resources of a small army and weeks to build. Or something. I'm still not sure, but I was envisioning something similar to what a few teenagers threw together as a raft years ago. But I get it. It's not like the wood needed to build it grows on trees. Wait, that's not right. Okay, hobgoblins never carry anything sharp enough to chop up small diameter wood. Wait, that can't be. Oh, right. The counter was "it's not possible, there's no Home Depot down the road."</p><p></p><p>In some cases raw materials will not be available, or the enemy won't be organized enough to build defenses, mobile or otherwise. Fine. In those cases they don't, come up with a different option. But I think a well provisioned unit will have adequate supplies for making camp including items not listed in the MM as weapons.</p><p></p><p>If in an enemy's home base, I think people greatly underestimate the thought and preparation put into defenses. Their lives depended on it after all.</p><p></p><p><strong>My opinion on Tiny Hut</strong></p><p>It's a decent spell and reasonably useful. I'm going to run it as intended in future campaigns - that you can't make ranged attacks outside the hut from inside. But beyond that, resting for 8 hours in an immobile encampment when the enemy knows you're there is generally going to be a really bad idea.</p><p></p><p>The very first time it was used, I hadn't thought about how to counter it and it was a bit problematic. Which is why I was attempting to offer advice and solicit other people's opinions on what could be done. "Nothing" IMHO is not a realistic option. Want to stick with the "Nothing can be done"? That's your option.</p><p></p><p>Rope trick has the same major issue the hut does. Time. The enemy knows there are invaders somewhere so they're going to be on high alert, double patrols, perhaps enact some extra defenses.</p><p></p><p><em>*BTW if the party does come up with some good counters, fantastic! I love it when players creatively overcome obstacles.</em></p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Oofta, post: 7883146, member: 6801845"] Not really a lot new here to respond to. [B]Dragons[/B] I brought up a dragon because it was mentioned in another thread that a dracolich (who didn't have dispel magic apparently) could do nothing while the party got a long rest. I pointed out the various things they could do, all of which were declared to be "pointless" for one reason or another with no supporting justification. Well, other than "I said it wouldn't work so therefore I've already shown you that it wouldn't work." So I gave details on how I would run a black dragon. Darkness so the party couldn't see and then bury the hut in whatever's handy. The response, of course is that's ridiculous and that the party would just counter it somehow. Again, no details or options given*. IMHO they have the option of leaving the hut before they get a long rest which is what the dragon wants or they're going to be buried under tons of crud. The only counter was that "they'll figure something out because they're smart like me". The hut is also supposedly a great spot to prep, and under certain circumstances it might be. But usually prep only takes a few actions, the hut takes 11 minutes. Not really seeing the benefit. Oh, and grabbing the NPC wizard was a joke, although I still think in many cases dragons will have allies or other resources that could be brought to bear. [B]The Home Depot[/B] This one kind of cracks me up to be honest. In my campaign I had a couple dozen hobgoblins build a temporary, makeshift wall so that they could approach the hut without being targeted by ranged attacks. This temporary wall was somehow transformed into an impenatrable engineering marvel that would require the resources of a small army and weeks to build. Or something. I'm still not sure, but I was envisioning something similar to what a few teenagers threw together as a raft years ago. But I get it. It's not like the wood needed to build it grows on trees. Wait, that's not right. Okay, hobgoblins never carry anything sharp enough to chop up small diameter wood. Wait, that can't be. Oh, right. The counter was "it's not possible, there's no Home Depot down the road." In some cases raw materials will not be available, or the enemy won't be organized enough to build defenses, mobile or otherwise. Fine. In those cases they don't, come up with a different option. But I think a well provisioned unit will have adequate supplies for making camp including items not listed in the MM as weapons. If in an enemy's home base, I think people greatly underestimate the thought and preparation put into defenses. Their lives depended on it after all. [B]My opinion on Tiny Hut[/B] It's a decent spell and reasonably useful. I'm going to run it as intended in future campaigns - that you can't make ranged attacks outside the hut from inside. But beyond that, resting for 8 hours in an immobile encampment when the enemy knows you're there is generally going to be a really bad idea. The very first time it was used, I hadn't thought about how to counter it and it was a bit problematic. Which is why I was attempting to offer advice and solicit other people's opinions on what could be done. "Nothing" IMHO is not a realistic option. Want to stick with the "Nothing can be done"? That's your option. Rope trick has the same major issue the hut does. Time. The enemy knows there are invaders somewhere so they're going to be on high alert, double patrols, perhaps enact some extra defenses. [I]*BTW if the party does come up with some good counters, fantastic! I love it when players creatively overcome obstacles.[/I] [/QUOTE]
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