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Message: <blockquote data-quote="The Sigil" data-source="post: 2191659" data-attributes="member: 2013">*chuckles*  Don't feel bad about responding.  Just because I "got published" (yeah, in a self-published PDF, big deal <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />) doesn't mean I'm perfect.Rather than respond to the points you outlined (I agree with some of them, in fact, but when I wrote my book I didn't want to deviate too far from the "RAW" - I tried to base costs for stuff roughly on the RAW, so as to not force everyone to throw out their item pricing charts, so right there I knew I'd run into "realism" problems), I will make one point...Part of the thing I kept in the back of my mind as I worked on this book was the fact that magic in the 3/3.5e system has a VERY unbalancing effect on skills... any fourth-level expert (a joiner, in the case you mentioned) would of course have masterwork tools, but another part of the problem is that magic items that give a competence bonus to skill are CHEAP.  The average 4th-level character has what, about 5,400 gp at his disposal?  Masterwork tools (+2 to craft roll) are a couple of hundred gp... leaving the character easily able to afford a "smock of Joining" that goes in the vest "slot" which gives him a +7 bonus to all Craft (Joining) rolls (4,900 gp).  As you mentioned, he probably has skill focus and max ranks (7 ranks + 3 from skill focus) and a 14 Int (+2) isn't unreasonable. In other words, the 23 isn't "average" for a fourth level joiner when taking 10... I would expect a 4th-level joiner to have an "average" of around 31 (10 + 2 for tools +7 for magic item) + 7 (ranks) +3 (skill focus) + 2 Int or 31.  However, no matter how skilled you are, there's a certain amount of time that has to go into each item (you have to wait for the wood to dry out when you moisten it to bend it, or wait for metal to cool, etc.) - so I couldn't have these "superskilled" craftsmen popping stuff off left and right.Because of this (the effect of skill-boosting magic items), I had to be careful how I built the system and assume that Craftspeople were taking advantage of the magic available to them.  An eighth-levle craftsman (probably in the employ of the king) should be able to pull a +16 skill bonus item with little difficulty; he's probably put all his ability increases into Int, giving him an average roll of 10 + 16 (item) + 2 (tools) + 3 (focus) + 11 (ranks) + 3 (Int) for a total of 45.To say nothing of the wise craftsman who keeps on hand (or is himself) a low-level bard with the "Inspire Competence" ability... that's another +2 there.In other words, craftsmens' skill (the DC they can hit) does *not* increase at the same rate that level increases; it increases 2-3 times as fast (because they leverage their money into skill-boosting items).  Adventurers won't want these skill boost items, by and large - they'll spend their money on weapons and armor -  but craftsmen will.  And I had to play it with intelligent craftsmen as well. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />Not saying you're wrong, just pointing out that it's something to think about... that in D&D, you can quickly attain DCs with the aid of magic that "historical" craftsmen (without magic) might not be able to hit in a lifetime.--The Sigil</blockquote>

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