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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Yaarel" data-source="post: 8684112" data-attributes="member: 58172">What you are saying disagrees with what scientists say.Whether animal behavioralists, neuropsychologists, anthropologists, sociologists, historians, archeologists, etcetera, all agree that the formation of a society, namely the learned group behaviors as opposed to instinct, is fundamental to the human species. Perhaps historians especially view the society and its cultural relativity as the primary mode of human identity constructs.Yes, penetration=femininity is a Hellenistic philosophical ideal, evident in philosophical debates. However, we likewise know from the Hellenistic comedies that many men did indeed enjoy penetration. Avoiding penetration is something like "polite" and "civil", whereas male-male penetration is "wilderness". Both happen. Likewise we know about Hellenistic transgender, intersex, and other identities.I am less knowledgeable about Indigenous South Americans and Central Americans. But I am skeptical about that interpretation because of other traditions that I am aware of, as well as historical reports from European Christian missionaries.Some cultures have thirdgender. Many cultures have two genders. The cultures that have thirdgender organize the understanding of it differently from each other.It is accurate to emphasize how the achievement cis-hetero supremacy is recent and artificial.Having a male body is different from having a female body, or an intersex body.Consider, for many gay men, the male body of their partner is precisely what matters. For other gay men, it is the gender of their partner that is fundamental to ones attraction.Each kind of body, each kind of gender, each kind of community is a reason to be proud of ones own identity.It comes across as somewhat homophobic or transphobic to claim that samesex couples or trans persons are unable to feel pride in who one oneself is.Patriotism is a near-universal example of human pride in ones own identity group. Pride is intrinsic to identity. It has little or no dependency on oppression.</blockquote>

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