Creating Characters Above 1st Level

[Jeremy]

The DMG has guidelines for about the amount of value your gear should have at whatever level it is you are creating your PC at. It also recommends that you set a maximum value for any one item of that gear. However, the two different methods it gives to assign this value seem to be entirely arbitrary.

The first method sets a limit on individual items of about 18.518% of the total value. The uneven number leads me to believe the author just picked 5,000 in the first one because it seemed a nice number.

The second method ranges from .03% (a 100 gp minor item) to 297% a +2 weapon which is a minor item.

I had thought I had read on boards or in the DMG or elsewhere that 50% of your total gear value is the amount not to be exceeded by any one of your new character's items. I have not been able to find that anywhere. What would you way is a good number?

We are currently creating 16th level characters to replace fallen or lost PC's and continue accompanying the surviving characters. So how do we make sure that the 16th level characters have 16th level equipment and can handle CRs 18-20 without making them over powerful (which of course is a matter of perspective, seeing as they are 16th level).

50% is what I remember reading, but 30% sounds doable as well. Opinions?

 

[Rel]

Our group uses 50%.

When I GM, I reserve the right to veto any individual item if I think it doesn't fit the character or if it is blatant metagaming (like if the party just found out they were going to have to fight some giants and the new character just happens to have a sword of giant slaying). So far I haven't had to veto anything.

 

[Drawmack]

Here are some methods I've used

20% on non-fighting gear.

30% on all your weapons, or weapon-like items (the bard's instrument, the wizard's spell components, etc.)

30% on armor or armor like items (ring of protection, etc)

20% on magical properties. If you want a +2 bastard sword, the price of the bastard sword comes out of the weapons money the difference in price for the +2 comees out of this amount of money.

These are maximums you do not have to spend all you money but can decide that your character is saving up for a great item or something and keep some money for that.

My favorite is tell the PCs playing the new characters to put it in their background that they lost everything except the clothes on their backs.

Then I give them some crappy weapons (usually the stuff from their class's starting package).

Then they go on a dungeon crawl in a keep where they get the weapons I want them to have. This gives me a bit more control and it is acctually a lot of fun. Just remember to adjust your CRs appropriatly. A 16th level fighter with a short sword is not as powerful as they assume a 16th level fighter will be, more like a 10 - 12th level fighter.

 

[Darklone]

We never used the rules exactly but asked the player to create some nice unique items for his character as well as background spice...

Should I say we mostly use nongeneric magic items?

As pricing guidelines... Depends on his story. Up to 100% actually... even more.

 

[Jeremy]

100%? So for a 16th level character who starts with 260,000 gp you'd let him spend every cent on say a Skin of Iron so that he could be a 16th level iron golem psion?

What is that? Like ECL 32 or something? Lord forbid he take Claws of the Vampire and start regenerating on top of his DR 50/+3. But then again, at 16th level he could just as well be throwing out 8th level powers from the safety of his new form.

 

[Spatzimaus]

I go with 25%. So, if you're level 15 (200k baseline), you can buy any item up to around 50k in cost (+5 weapon, +7 armor). Yes, I know a +5 weapon will actually be 50,000 (enchantment) + 300 (masterwork) + pocket change (raw material), just round off.

In addition, these items must be available equipment in your hometown. If I decide Mithral is really rare in this world, don't go making every item out of it. If no one in the city makes Katanas, don't ask for one.

But, I allow any one item to be a custom item. It still has to be balanced (i.e., I set the price, not you) but unlike the other items there won't be a debate about availablility or whether it should be available at all; only the price is negotiable.

 

[Jeremy]

Bump for those not out with the kiddies.

 

[Pax]

Here are some methods I've used

20% on non-fighting gear.

30% on all your weapons, or weapon-like items (the bard's instrument, the wizard's spell components, etc.)

30% on armor or armor like items (ring of protection, etc)

20% on magical properties. If you want a +2 bastard sword, the price of the bastard sword comes out of the weapons money the difference in price for the +2 comees out of this amount of money.

Um.

That might work at lower levels, but it falls apart if you go for higher level characetrs. Take (extreme example) a 20th level character; their starting money is 760,000gp; 30% of that spent on weapons (aside from the magical properties) is 228,000gp of nonmagical arms and armor ... ?

And some characters don't HAVE weapons (I've played monks; they own no weapons, no armor, nothing of the sort ...).

Taking a cue from your point later (the 16th level fighter), 16thlevel characters get 260,000gp.

How in the Nine Hells do you spend 78,000gp on nonmagical arms, armor, and related items ... ?!?

[...] Then they go on a dungeon crawl in a keep where they get the weapons I want them to have. This gives me a bit more control and it is acctually a lot of fun. Just remember to adjust your CRs appropriatly. A 16th level fighter with a short sword is not as powerful as they assume a 16th level fighter will be, more like a 10 - 12th level fighter.

Actually, a 16thlevel fighter with a shortsword enchanted appropriately for his level -- and more to the point, a 16thlevel fighter who's feats SUPPORT use of that shortsword -- is entirely as powerful as the presumption is. However, a 16th level fighter, who planned to use a Greatsword, and whose feats all aim at two-handed use of big swords, forced to use a shortsword ... you're right, they're much less powerful. Why? Because they've essentially been forced to waste several of their feats, perhaps MOST of them.

I *do* hope you at least set the base FORM of the weaons, to match what the players' feats (and stated desirs for "theme / schtick") point at ... I mean, (for example) not letting the Fighter(5)/Lasher(2) even have a WHIP, is a bit harsh.

 

[Jeremy]

Anyone else ever set a cap on the value of individual items for players creating PC's above 1st? We've got 50% as the only suggestion so far not counting the one that divides your funds into group purchases.

I'd like to think that by 12th level a character should have his +6 stat booster (PC's, not NPC's), given that the +6 costs 36k, that's about 40% of the characters total gear value at 12th. Which falls nicely inbetween the 50% and 30% maximums I was going to recommend.

40% sound good?

 

[shilsen]

Anyone else ever set a cap on the value of individual items for players creating PC's above 1st? We've got 50% as the only suggestion so far not counting the one that divides your funds into group purchases.

I'd like to think that by 12th level a character should have his +6 stat booster (PC's, not NPC's), given that the +6 costs 36k, that's about 40% of the characters total gear value at 12th. Which falls nicely inbetween the 50% and 30% maximums I was going to recommend.

40% sound good?

I use a cap of 50% too, but 40% sounds good. In our current campaign (this time I'm playing, not DM-ing), the costliest item owned by most of the 10th or 11th lvl PCs is a +4 stat-boosting item. That's 16k, which is approx. 30% of a 10th lvl PC's wealth and less than 25% of an 11th lvl one. My 11th lvl archer-type's costliest item is a +2 weapon, which is about 12% of his total wealth. These PCs were played from low-levels, and nobody feels that they're underequipped as far as magic items are concerned.