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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Mistwell" data-source="post: 3433365" data-attributes="member: 2525">Most opponents do not have ranks in spellcraft.  Those who do may well detect it, but then they have to communicate it to others, and the others simply get a bonus to detect it then.  Also, spellcasters that specialize in illusions tend to have silent spell (still spell is not as necessary in my opinion).  Indeed, the best illusionist PRC comes with silent spell already automatically on all his illusion spells (Shadowcraft Mage).  How many opponents do you know that take an action in the middle of combat to touch all walls to make sure they are real?  As for the archer, the more advanced figment spells can have the illusion react appropriately to an attack.Indeed.  Not sure why this is a point against figments in general.  If you overcome a spell, you overcome a spell.  Same for most spells.Are you seriously saying your opponents will notice if you take a full round action or a standard action to summon the creature, and therefore will assume it is an illusion if you take a standard action?  Wow, now there is a DM that would learn to regret meta-gaming real quick, as there are many ways to get a creature going without a full round action, and assuming that creature is an illusion will generally mean you ignore it and hence lose your dex bonus to AC.  In fact, that would be the sort of DM that is begging for shadow illusions that are close to 100% real if disbelieved.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f621.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":mad:" title="Mad    :mad:"  data-smilie="4"data-shortname=":mad:" /> Not to mention, you COULD take a full round action to cast it if you really think this is an issue.  But, I think most DMs will not.First, I added nothing to nothing.  Those are not my examples, and I said that in the post.  I just keep a list of other people's examples.  Second, it doesn't say you can't, and therefore I list them because some DMs will allow that (and some will not).Not sure why this is a drawback for figments, or addresses how to use figments creatively.They do, however when they become that higher level to do that damage, their type changes from figment to shadow.  Shadow Evocation and Shadow Conjuration, and the Shadowcraft Mage power Shadow Illusion, all do this.The list doesn't show anything about anything, and I think you know that was a serious stretch.  People HAVE come up with thousands of good uses for images, and not dozens.  This isn't some comprehensive list.  It's just the act of one guy (me) to make a vague half-hearted effort to list some of the interesting uses for a type of spell that he has seen.  I mean, what the heck were you thinking elevating this one thread to somehow the level of "this is the totality of all that people have ever been able to do with these kinds of spells, and because this list is not that long, it means the spells have no utility"? Um, at the time the list was composed there was not RAW on the topic I believe.  And it DID say that some DMs will not allow that item, back when it was written.  You need to chill out a bit dude.  It's just some stuff I have seen people suggest over time that I copied and pasted onto a list and posted in a message.  That's it.I agree, not a trick I would use, but some DMs might make it a move action at least (similar to stowing or retrieving a weapon).I disagree.  The text of programmed image and persistent image suggests to me that figments are capable of quite a lot of change.  And, I think many DMs allow an illusion to change, particularly if it is in line with the creature that the image is representing.  If you make a figment of a dragon, I think a lot of DMs will allow the illusion to breath fire (within the range of the spell of course).Four 10-ft. cubes + one 10-ft. cube/level.  You really think that is extremely limited area? Not me.  Not too hard to guess which general part of the room your opponents are most likely to be in during most of the battle.Again, I disagree, and I think many DMs allow figments to change.  This isn't a rules debate KarinsDad, it's a list that some people may find useful for their games.  If a particular DM doesn't allow images to change like you don't let them do, they can ignore that item on the list.  But some DMs do allow it, hence it is on the list.Did you have something positive to contribute to the thread?</blockquote>

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