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<blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 8928523" data-attributes="member: 4937">It's a kind of nice upgrade of some very old school D&amp;D skills (I mean literally, look at the name &quot;Bend Bars, Lift Gates&quot;), but I don't feel like that is really all that different than old school D&amp;D skills.&nbsp; Spout Lore is more or less the D&amp;D Knowledge skill generalized.&nbsp; Players are always the source of their own background/backstory so I can't imagine a situation where I wouldn't affirm the source of the lore in D&amp;D.&nbsp; The important point though is the lore is narrated by the GM.&nbsp; It would be the power to recontextualize if on 10+ the player got to narrate Lore that was true.&nbsp; But just saying in response to the GM, &quot;My character learned this when they were doing their apprenticeship&quot; or &quot;I overheard a traveler in bar say this.&quot; or &quot;I read in the Junior Woodchuck Guide&quot; doesn't recontexualize the scene.&nbsp; I do like how they made Bend Bars/Lift Gates/Break Object into a skill that Fighters are proficient at which is the sort of thing I would do (and probably should have done, and probably will do now that I have meaningful template for how breaking things skillfully might work), but this is really not that different than proposing to your GM, &quot;Can I break the X without making a lot of noise?&quot; and the GM setting a DC for that.&nbsp; You could already do that in any edition of D&amp;D.&nbsp; If you could come up with a plausible explanation how you broke it without making a lot of noise or damaging it beyond repair, in old school D&amp;D you probably wouldn't even need to roll to do it.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Celebrim, post: 8928523, member: 4937"] It's a kind of nice upgrade of some very old school D&D skills (I mean literally, look at the name "Bend Bars, Lift Gates"), but I don't feel like that is really all that different than old school D&D skills. Spout Lore is more or less the D&D Knowledge skill generalized. Players are always the source of their own background/backstory so I can't imagine a situation where I wouldn't affirm the source of the lore in D&D. The important point though is the lore is narrated by the GM. It would be the power to recontextualize if on 10+ [B]the player[/B] got to narrate Lore that was true. But just saying in response to the GM, "My character learned this when they were doing their apprenticeship" or "I overheard a traveler in bar say this." or "I read in the Junior Woodchuck Guide" doesn't recontexualize the scene. I do like how they made Bend Bars/Lift Gates/Break Object into a skill that Fighters are proficient at which is the sort of thing I would do (and probably should have done, and probably will do now that I have meaningful template for how breaking things skillfully might work), but this is really not that different than proposing to your GM, "Can I break the X without making a lot of noise?" and the GM setting a DC for that. You could already do that in any edition of D&D. If you could come up with a plausible explanation how you broke it without making a lot of noise or damaging it beyond repair, in old school D&D you probably wouldn't even need to roll to do it. [/QUOTE]

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