Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
The
VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX
is LIVE! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Creativity?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 8929444" data-attributes="member: 42582"><p>The first quoted sentence doesn't entail the second.</p><p></p><p>Here's <a href="http://lumpley.com/hardcore.html" target="_blank">some more from Vincent Baker</a> - in my view perhaps the best single thing he's ever said about RPG design:</p><p></p><p style="margin-left: 20px">Roleplaying is negotiated imagination. In order for any thing to be true in game, all the participants in the game (players and GMs, if you've even got such things) have to understand and assent to it. When you're roleplaying, what you're doing is a) suggesting things that might be true in the game and then b) negotiating with the other participants to determine whether they're actually true or not.</p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"><snip></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px"></p> <p style="margin-left: 20px">Mechanics might model the stuff of the game world, that's another topic, but they don't exist to do so. They exist to ease and constrain real-world social negotiation between the players at the table. That's their sole and crucial function.</p><p></p><p>There are at least two ways the mechanics can facilitate resolution of, or even flat-out resolve, the question of <em>who gets to add new truths to the fiction</em>. One is by brining the participants closer in to the fiction, focusing on its details, making imaginative action declarations that play on those details and thus lead to everyone at the table accepting new truths about them.</p><p></p><p>The other is by bringing the participants to focus on the mechanics themselves as those operate independently of the fiction, to work out the mathematical, logical, conceptual or similar sorts of relationships between them, and from that to deduce a new state of the fiction.</p><p></p><p>The Rope Trick/Wall of Force scenario is an example of the second thing. All the recent climb checks that I've adjudicated (actually Dungeoneer checks in Torchbearer) have been examples of the first. Some ways the 3E D&D skill system operates - the ones I'm thinking of a are Diplomacy and Perception - operate in the second way. This is in my view a weakness of the 3E skill system. The ability to "take 10" I think doesn't bear on this at all. It's about whether or not the resolution process brings play into sustained contact with the shared fiction.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="pemerton, post: 8929444, member: 42582"] The first quoted sentence doesn't entail the second. Here's [url=http://lumpley.com/hardcore.html]some more from Vincent Baker[/url] - in my view perhaps the best single thing he's ever said about RPG design: [indent]Roleplaying is negotiated imagination. In order for any thing to be true in game, all the participants in the game (players and GMs, if you've even got such things) have to understand and assent to it. When you're roleplaying, what you're doing is a) suggesting things that might be true in the game and then b) negotiating with the other participants to determine whether they're actually true or not. <snip> Mechanics might model the stuff of the game world, that's another topic, but they don't exist to do so. They exist to ease and constrain real-world social negotiation between the players at the table. That's their sole and crucial function.[/indent] There are at least two ways the mechanics can facilitate resolution of, or even flat-out resolve, the question of [i]who gets to add new truths to the fiction[/i]. One is by brining the participants closer in to the fiction, focusing on its details, making imaginative action declarations that play on those details and thus lead to everyone at the table accepting new truths about them. The other is by bringing the participants to focus on the mechanics themselves as those operate independently of the fiction, to work out the mathematical, logical, conceptual or similar sorts of relationships between them, and from that to deduce a new state of the fiction. The Rope Trick/Wall of Force scenario is an example of the second thing. All the recent climb checks that I've adjudicated (actually Dungeoneer checks in Torchbearer) have been examples of the first. Some ways the 3E D&D skill system operates - the ones I'm thinking of a are Diplomacy and Perception - operate in the second way. This is in my view a weakness of the 3E skill system. The ability to "take 10" I think doesn't bear on this at all. It's about whether or not the resolution process brings play into sustained contact with the shared fiction. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
Creativity?
Top